Dog Brothers Public Forum
DBMA Martial Arts Forum => Martial Arts Topics => Topic started by: Crafty_Dog on March 15, 2007, 07:04:54 AM
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There's a thread on the Poltical forum about the political side of this movie, but we need one here to focus on Inosanto alumnae
Damon Caro and Chad Stahelski who choreographed the fights and the martial arts side of things. Here's this about the training regime some of the actors and stunt men followed:
http://www.gymjones.com/knowledge.php?id=35
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Love seeing the kettlebell in there!
tom
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That is insane. God I'm out of shape...
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This might be a dumb question and since it was taken from a comic book, I was just wondering about the accuracy of the sword that the Spartans used? I thought it looked pretty cool.
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This might be a dumb question and since it was taken from a comic book, I was just wondering about the accuracy of the sword that the Spartans used? I thought it looked pretty cool.
Well I'm far from an expert on the topic so anyone feel free to correct me, but it looked like to me that the swords used in the movie seemed like they were a stylized version of the falcata which was a sword used primarily in the Iberian(spanish) and celtic lands. As I understand it, the falcata itself is very similar to the greek kopis and makhaira weapons but these most likely would not have been used by foot soldiers who, due to their tactical use of the phalanx formation would prefer straight-bladed, thrusting swords like the xiphos over the curvier, slashing blades which most likely were used primarily by cavalry.
So to sum up, if you are asking if it's accurate that there were weapons sort of similar to the design of the ones in the movie in use around that time the answer is "yes," but if you are asking if its accurate that Spartan hoplites would have been using them the answer is "probably not."
I'm sure someone more knowledgeable than I will give better details (or even show that I am way off-base.)
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Here is something I gleaned off of the internet at this website:
http://www.ospreypublishing.com/content2.php/cid=217
Indeed the eminent archaeologist Anthony Snodgrass stated in his book Arms and Armour of the Greeks, which first appeared in 1967 but is still the principal comprehensive work on the subject, that 'Chalcis became the outstanding centre of production of iron swords in Greece, as Toledo did of steel in medieval Europe'.
The sword with leaf-shaped blade could be used for both cut and thrust, but it is clear from the representational evidence that it was principally used in a downward cut. In fact we have few detailed clues as to how it was used. An interesting vase in the British Museum depicts a duel between Achilles and Hektor. Achilles on the left is still fighting with his spear, but Hektor has lost his, and is about to launch a violent attack with his drawn sword, which is of the standard type with its leaf-shaped blade. He has thrown the sword backwards in his right hand, and is about to rush on Achilles. As he runs in he will swing the sword forwards and upwards, and then up over the right shoulder, flexing his elbow and holding his chest and shoulders as high up as possible, in order to bring it down in front of him with the maximum force. Interestingly, and presumably by mistake, the artist has given Hektor a second sword housed in his scabbard.
The swelling of the blade, both in width and thickness, towards the point, which gives it its distinctive leaf shape, is presumably designed to move the centre of gravity of the blade forwards towards the point, and as far away from the hand as possible, to maximise the force of the downward blow. The emphasis was placed on the downward cut, and so we also find the Greeks making use of two types of curved and single-bladed swords designed to maximise the force of the blow.
The first type is best described as a recurved sabre. Shaped like a Gurkha kukri or a yataghan [a muslim long curved knife], the back of the blade curves forward, and the main weight of the weapon lies near the tip. The cutting edge is on the concave side. The hilt sometimes ends in the shape of a bird or animal head, or curves back to guard the knuckles in the shape of a 'knuckle-duster'. The weapon is often shown being used in a backhand cut. A good example of this is a vase in Bologna that shows an Amazon hoplite swinging a recurved sabre back over her left shoulder. She is about to deliver a diagonal slashing stroke to her front and right with it. Recurved sabres are very common in Iberia, but all these examples seem to be later in date, and it is possible they represent a later spread in the use of the weapon out of the Greek world to the west.
Finally the Greeks also used a third type of sword, not previously distinguished from the recurved sabre by Greek archaeologists, which, in comparison with the standard terminology used for medieval weaponry, we might best term a 'falchion'. Other suitable terms might be 'backsword' or 'pallasch'. It also had a heavy single-edged blade, whose back was either straight or slightly concave, but not recurved like the sabre described above, while the edge has a pronounced convex curve and broadens considerably towards the point. Like the recurved sabre the falchion also came into use in the later 6th century. The falchion is only shown on a limited number of vase paintings, and its popularity does not seem to have survived long into the 5th century.
Recurved sabres and falchions are both shown being used by Achaemenid troops on Greek vases.
Cheers,
Karsk
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Two interesting little Films:
http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=8869960776561508689&q=300
http://video.google.de/videoplay?docid=7171100432146678666&q=300
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This might be a dumb question and since it was taken from a comic book, I was just wondering about the accuracy of the sword that the Spartans used? I thought it looked pretty cool.
See here:
http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/300-spartan-swords.html
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Here is the video. Nice stuff.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=w6Eyg32W4aE
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This might be a dumb question and since it was taken from a comic book, I was just wondering about the accuracy of the sword that the Spartans used? I thought it looked pretty cool.
See here:
http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/300-spartan-swords.html
Thanks for the link Blain!
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man this video gold!!! :mrgreen:
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This might be a dumb question and since it was taken from a comic book, I was just wondering about the accuracy of the sword that the Spartans used? I thought it looked pretty cool.
See here:
http://www.sword-buyers-guide.com/300-spartan-swords.html
The Spartan sword kinda reminds me of the Kelly Worden Machete... Not much, but when I saw 300 the machete came to mind right away 8-)
http://www.discountcutlery.net/en-us/dept_22692.html (scroll down to find)
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man this video gold!!! :mrgreen:
If anyone is interested here is a link to another site that is the same type of plan as Gym Jones, Mark Twight.
http://www.crossfit.com/
Jeff
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Here is a link to a superior combatives and conditioning facility on the East Coast.
The Warriors Forge: www.teamruthless.com
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For those who are unfamiliar with Ross Enamait, you need to be:
http://www.rosstraining.com/
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I got my rings today and put them in the weight room at the gym. So far people LOVE them.
:-D
Gruhn
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I got my rings today and put them in the weight room at the gym. So far people LOVE them.
:-D
Gruhn
I have used the ring'son occasion and they are a great tool, they realy work the stabilizer muscle'swhen doing dip's, elevated push up's and such.
Jeff
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At last the wife and I arranged a date last night and planned to see "300". Long story short, after much misadventure 300 became impossible and in search of brownie points I deferred to her request for "Perfect Stranger" which I found perfectly boring. Ugh.
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I know after watching 300 I just wanted to go work out. :-D
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At last the wife and I arranged a date last night and planned to see "300". Long story short, after much misadventure 300 became impossible and in search of brownie points I deferred to her request for "Perfect Stranger" which I found perfectly boring. Ugh.
You don't think she would have been in for Planet Terror, huh?
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Have to pipe in fellow martial artist. For the love of God dont see Grindhouse , by all means see 3OO If you have seen it all already see it again!! Ha HA HA Sorry to hear this Crafty for once you seen this movie Its just pumps you up!!! My training partner and I seen it once we hit town for the semm in Penn and that does not get you ready for a Dogbrothers semm I dont know what would HA HA HA .Hey Ryan where did you get your rings at? :-D
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I've taken to gymjones-type training recently, and the 300 isn't as impossible as you might think. I'm kind of a big guy (6'1", 240 lbs) and I've done the 300 twice now. My first time was around 25 mins, and my second time was 23:25. It's a very good test of funtional strength/endurance. A friend just did it today- he's only 5'5", 145 lbs, and he made it through in 43 mins.
It can be done!
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I agree 100% with Cuchulain. I've been getting most of my workout ideas from Gym Jones for quite a while now. They're consistently fun and challenging ...and the fitness/health results have been great. Just be sure you read their disclaimer first. It stresses personal responsibility. Like I've heard Guro Crafty say in all the video's I've seen, "Only you are responsible for you."
Train well...
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Ryan
I just saw that you got a set of rings.
The link below shows a nice ring exercise that is deceptively hard.
http://ironpunk.blogspot.com/2006/06/push-ups-w-rings-that-rock.html
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The rings are a staple of the Team Ruthless workouts of the day. Here was today's (not that I did it :-) ):
For time:
50 Sumo Deadlift High Pulls (65lbs/95lbs)
50 Ring Rows
50 Alternating One Arm Kettlebell Swings (20kg/28kg)
50 Hanging Knees to Elbows
50 Wall Ball Shots (16lbs/25lbs)
50 Pike Ups
50 Squatting Slam Ball Slams (20lbs/25lbs)
50 Push Ups
Run 1,600 Meters
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Hallelujah! My wonderful wife bought me a copy of 300 and I finally got to sit down and watch it. The children were out, the wife was out, and the TV was cranked up 8-)