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51  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Re: Issues in the American Creed (Constitutional Law and related matters) on: August 03, 2014, 08:57:51 PM
He will grant amnesty.   My guess after the 2014 election.   And no one can stop him.  Period.
52  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / News from Marc Levin's website on: August 03, 2014, 01:08:47 PM
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2704715/Multiple-injuries-reported-shots-fired-Pennsylvania-hospital.html
53  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / I am not holding my breath but... on: August 03, 2014, 12:26:29 PM
The liberal Jews may not be thrilled with the Democratic leaderships view on Israel but I still doubt they will vote for Republicans.   They just can't do it.   Just the same Israel's interests are only a small part of the reason they need to ditch the Democrat party.   First and foremost, how about supporting a country that puts America first?  I also don't know why they feel the need to cozy up to radical blacks.   The radical blacks certainly do NOT return the favor as one can see:

http://thehill.com/homenews/administration/214135-gop-sees-signs-of-jewish-voters-drifting-away-from-democrats

That all said is we need people to be Americans first whether Jewish, Christian, Muslim, Black, White, Asian etc.

The Democratic party hijacked by socialists is not putting America first.

OTOH not all Republicans are doing this either.
54  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Neolithic people caused world sea levels to rise on: August 03, 2014, 08:02:24 AM
Somewhere around 8000BC.   This may have been the basis of the great flood myths that appear in ancient myths and eventually the Bible:

http://www.eurekalert.org/pub_releases/2007-11/uoe-fk111507.php
55  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Zakaria on the proxy war in Gaza on: August 02, 2014, 09:57:25 PM
Zakaria - > Gaza is now a proxy war. 

[No mention of his Harvard pal the anti-Semite Bamster being on the wrong side - AGAIN.  For that matter so is his network CNN]

"This time, Gaza fighting is 'proxy war' for entire Mideast
 
By Josh Levs, CNN

updated 1:48 PM EDT, Fri August 1, 2014
 
 The Gaza conflict is a proxy war for the Middle East, analysts say
Egypt, Jordan, and Saudi Arabia are seen as supporting Israel's crackdown on Hamas
Turkey and Qatar support Hamas
Hamas is an extension of the Muslim Brotherhood, which threatens some governments
 
  (CNN) -- The conflict raging in Gaza is different this time.

While Hamas' rocket attacks and Israel's military actions may look familiar, they're taking place against a whole new backdrop.

"This is unprecedented in the history of the Arab-Israeli conflict," says CNN's Ali Younes, an analyst who has covered the region for decades. "Most Arab states are actively supporting Israel against the Palestinians -- and not even shy about it or doing it discreetly."

It's a "joint Arab-Israeli war consisting of Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia against other Arabs -- the Palestinians as represented by Hamas."

As the New York Times put it, "Arab leaders, viewing Hamas as worse than Israel, stay silent."

Most Arab states are actively supporting Israel.
CNN's Ali Younes, Mideast analyst

One of the outcomes of the fighting will likely be "the end of the old Arab alliance system that has, even nominally, supported the Palestinians and their goal of establishing a Palestinian state," Younes says.

"The Israel-Hamas conflict has laid bare the new divides of the Middle East," says Danielle Pletka, vice president of foreign and defense policy studies at the American Enterprise Institute. "It's no longer the Muslims against the Jews. Now it's the extremists -- the Muslim Brotherhood, Hamas, Hezbollah, and their backers Iran, Qatar and Turkey -- against Israel and the more moderate Muslims including Jordan, Egypt, and Saudi Arabia."

"It's a proxy war for control or dominance in the Middle East," says CNN's Fareed Zakaria.

To understand why and what all this means, we need to begin with understanding of Hamas.

Zakaria: Gaza is 'proxy war' for Mideast
Hamas and the Muslim Brotherhood
 
Hamas, which has controlled the Palestinian government in Gaza for years, is an extension of the Muslim Brotherhood. To many Americans, the brotherhood is familiar for its central role in the power struggle for Egypt. But it's much larger than that.

"The Muslim Brotherhood is international, with affiliated groups in more than 70 countries, including Saudi Arabia and the UAE," says Eric Trager of the Washington Institute for Near East Policy.

The Arab Spring showed the region that uprisings can lead to the Brotherhood gaining power. So it's a threat to the governments it opposes.

"Israel's ongoing battle against Hamas is part of a wider regional war on the Muslim Brotherhood," says the Soufan Group, which tracks global security. "Most Arab states share Israel's determination to finish the movement off once and for all, but they are unlikely to be successful."

"From the perspective of Egypt, Saudi Arabia, Jordan, the UAE and some other Arab states, what the Israeli Prime Minister is doing is fighting this war against Hamas on their behalf so they can finish the last stronghold of the Muslim Brotherhood," Younes says.

"Arab governments and official Arab media have all but adopted the Israeli view of who is a terrorist and who is not. Egyptian and Saudi-owned media are liberal in labeling the Muslim Brotherhood as 'terrorists' and describing Hamas as a 'terrorist organization.' It's a complete turnabout from the past, when Arab states fought Israel and the U.S. in the international organizations on the definition of terrorism, and who is a terrorist or a 'freedom fighter.'"

Egypt's new President vowed during his campaign that he would finish off the Muslim Brotherhood. Abdel Fattah el-Sisi, the former military chief, deposed Egypt's first freely elected leader, President Mohamed Morsy of the Muslim Brotherhood, last year following mass protests against Morsy's rule.

El-Sisi was elected officially in June.

"In Egypt you have a regime that came to power by toppling a Muslim Brotherhood government," says Trager. "It's therefore in an existential conflict with the Brotherhood. So it doesn't want to see Hamas, the Palestinian Muslim Brotherhood, emerge stronger in a neighboring territory."

Egypt also has another reason to stand against Hamas: rising violence and instability in Sinai, the northern part of Egypt that borders Israel and Gaza. Hamas' network of tunnels includes some in and out of Egypt used to smuggle goods include weapons for attackson Israeli civilians.

It's part of a regional war on the Muslim Brotherhood.
The Soufan Group, which tracks global security

The new Egyptian government has been "cracking down aggressively since it removed the brotherhood from power," Trager says.

El-Sisi closed the border crossings between Egypt and Gaza, which has helped block Hamas militants from escaping or smuggling in more weapons during Israel's onslaught. But it also has contributed to the humanitarian crisis of people trapped in Gaza.

Egypt proposed a cease-fire, and Israel quickly accepted it -- indicating that it contained the terms Israel was looking for, analysts say. Hamas rejected it. While Egypt has worked furiously to try to broker a truce in the past, Cairo this time shows little rush to change its proposal to one much more favorable to Hamas, analysts say.

Saudi Arabia, UAE, Jordan

The monarchies of Saudi Arabia, the United Arab Emirates and Jordan have called on Hamas to accept the cease-fire proposal as is.

"We condemn the Israeli aggression and we support the Egyptian cease-fire proposal," Jordan's King Abdullah said last week.

Countries such as Saudi Arabia and the UAE are "challenged by Islamists who come to power via the ballot box rather than through royal succession," says Trager.

The Saudis and Egyptians are more scared of Islamic fundamentalism than they are of Israel.
CNN's Fareed Zakaria

"So these countries have been directly supportive of the coup in Egypt because it removed elected Islamists and therefore discredited that model."

Saudi Arabia is "leading the charge," partly through backing the coup and financing state media reports that attacked the brotherhood, says Younes.

"Egypt, Jordan, Saudi Arabia and the UAE all see the destruction of Hamas as of benefit to their internal security as well as to regional stability."

"The Saudis and the Egyptians are now more scared of Islamic fundamentalism than they are of Israel," says Zakaria.

"The Saudi monarchy is more worried about the prospects of Hamas winning, which would embolden Islamists in other parts of the Middle East, and therefore potentially an Islamist opposition in Saudi Arabia."

But Hamas is not alone.

Turkey and Qatar remain supportive of Hamas.

Qatar supported Egypt's Muslim Brotherhood government, and built "an Egypt-centric Al Jazeera network that became known for its strongly pro-Muslim Brotherhood line," says Trager.

Qatar also funds many Muslim Brotherhood figures in exile, including Hamas political leader Khaled Mashaal, who is believed to have orchestrated numerous Hamas terrorist attacks.

"I think this is a case of a country with a lot of money to burn making a certain calculation in 2011 that made a lot of sense at the time: that the Brotherhood was the next big thing that was going to dominate many of the countries of the region," says Trager. "Realistically, it made sense to bet on it."

Turkey has "more of an ideological sympathy with the Brotherhood," he says.

Erdogan has tried to use the cause of the Brotherhood to bolster his own Islamist credentials.
Eric Trager, Washington Institute

Last week, Turkish Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan spoke with CNN, accusing Israel of "genocide."

"Erdogan has tried to use the cause of the Brotherhood to bolster his own Islamist credentials at home," says Trager. Last year, Erdogan cracked down on mass demonstrations in his country.

Iran has long supported Hamas, supplying it with weapons. And Meshaal used to be based in Syria.

But that changed. In 2012, Meshaal left Syria as the country's civil war deepened -- a decision believed to have caused a breakdown in his relationship with Iran as well, says Firas Abi Ali, head of Middle East and North Africa Country Risk and Forecasting at the global information company IHS. Tehran is aligned with Syrian President Bashar al-Assad's regime.

Now, Syria -- Israel's neighbor to the north -- is locked in a brutal, multiparty civil war, with Islamist extremists hoisting severed heads onto poles. The war, believed to have killed more than 115,000 people, is just one of the many developments emphasizing how many "fault lines" there are in the region, Richard Haass, president of Council on Foreign Relations, told "CNN Tonight."

"There's fault lines within the Palestinians between Hamas and the other part of the Palestinian Authority. You have Sunnis vs. Shia. You have Iran vs. Saudi Arabia and the Arabs. You have secularists vs. people who embrace religion in the political space."

The Palestinian Authority

Paying a price for all this is another key player: Fatah, the Palestinian faction that controls the West Bank. Fatah and Hamas have long fought each other, but earlier this year made another effort at a unity government.

Palestinian leader Mahmoud Abbas, who is in charge of the government in the West Bank, "seems politically exhausted by all the twists and turns he has made in search of a durable solution," the Soufan Gruop says. "And the one chance of reasserting his authority through a unity government that would have forced Hamas into a subordinate and less militant role has now disappeared. He must now watch helplessly as protests in the West Bank undo whatever progress he had made towards a two-state solution."

Gaza conflict by the numbers
 
CNN's Jethro Mullen, Brian Todd
56  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Zbigniew on: August 02, 2014, 09:51:09 PM
Nothing  like giving a failed NSA from a failed Presidency a chance to give his worthless anti-Semitic (as he always has been) opinion.   So his daughters remark "morning Jew" was not just a slip of the tongue.  Here he goes off again:     
 
Brzezinski: Netanyahu 'making a very serious mistake'

Discussion in 'Middle East & Africa' started by Hazzy997, Yesterday at 4:29 AM.
Yesterday at 4:29 AM  #1 

 Joined:Apr 13, 2013Messages:11,425Ratings: +10 / 9,529 / -4  Palestinian Territory, OccupiedUnited States

Brzezinski: Netanyahu 'making a very serious mistake'

 Watch"Fareed Zakaria GPS," Sundays at 10 a.m. and 1 p.m. ET on CNN

 Fareed speaks with former U.S. National Security Advisor Zbigniew Brzezinski about Israel's military operation in Gaza.

 Israeli Prime Minister Netanyahu on CNN told Wolf Blitzer that the invasion of Gaza was a strategy to demilitarize Gaza, explaining the use of force. But it has been quite a robust use of force…Do you think that it is going to succeed, the Israeli strategy?

 No, I think he is making a very serious mistake. When Hamas in effect accepted the notion of participation in the Palestinian leadership, it in effect acknowledged the determination of that leadership to seek a peaceful solution with Israel. That was a real option. They should have persisted in that.

Instead Netanyahu launched the campaign of defamation against Hamas, seized on the killing of three innocent Israeli kids to immediately charge Hamas with having done it without any evidence, and has used that to stir up public opinion in Israel in order to justify this attack on Gaza, which is so lethal.

 I think he is isolating Israel. He's endangering its longer-range future. And I think we ought to make it very clear that this is a course of action which we thoroughly disapprove and which we do not support and which may compel us and the rest of the international community to take some steps of legitimizing Palestinian aspirations perhaps in the U.N.

57  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Re: Issues in the American Creed (Constitutional Law and related matters) on: August 01, 2014, 08:26:26 PM
Bigdog,
Thank you.

The author of both those articles does not paint a positive outlook to say the least.

Just tends to bolster the belief that Boehner is in way over his head as speaker.
58  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Finally on: July 31, 2014, 07:20:01 PM
A guy willing to stand up to white collar corruption.  This guy is now my hero:

http://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/31/nyregion/us-attorney-warns-cuomo-on-ethics-case-.html?_r=0
59  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Have babies to kill Jews on: July 31, 2014, 09:53:55 AM
It's right here.  Palestinians having babies up there with the highest rates in the world.   Many even point out it is to sacrifice them against Israel.   Where is the world condemnation of this?:

Palastinina birth rate explodes


April 21, 2002|By Tom Hundley Foreign Correspondent


SHUFAT REFUGEE CAMP, Israel — Married at 15, she gave birth to her first child less than a year later. Six months ago, she gave birth to her eighth. Fatima Shaher, 31, a Palestinian woman with dark eyes and an easy smile, loves children. She said she expects to have more.

In recent weeks, Israel has been unnerved by a ferocious wave of suicide bombs that has turned the simple act of boarding a city bus or eating in a crowded restaurant into an existential calculation. But some Israelis say that ticking beneath the surface of the violent confrontation between Arab and Jew, is a silent bomb, a demographic bomb.

Shaher and other Palestinian women are producing babies at one of the highest rates in the world. While Israelis are alarmed by the trend, Palestinians have mixed views. Some see it as their ultimate weapon; Palestinian leader Yasser Arafat once referred to Palestinian mothers as his "biological bomb." Others see the explosive birth rate as a catastrophe that will keep the Palestinians mired in poverty and despair.

Among Palestinians living in the West Bank and Gaza Strip, the annual birth rate is 40 for every 1,000 of population; among Palestinians living in Israel, it drops slightly to 36 per 1,000. The birth rate among Jews across the region is 18.3 per thousand -- high by European standards but less than half that of the Palestinians.

At the moment, the population is evenly balanced between Arabs and Jews. But as the competition heats up for scarce living space and water resources, the Palestinians are on the brink of a population explosion that will swamp the Jewish populace in less than a generation.

The dry, narrow strip of land between the Jordan River and the Mediterranean Sea is already crowded with 9.7 million people. Arnon Sofer, a demographer at Israel's Haifa University, predicted last year that by 2020 the number of people living on the land will swell to 15.2 million, 58 percent of them non-Jews.

Similarly, a U.N. study predicts that by 2050 the population in the West Bank and Gaza will almost quadruple to almost 12 million.

Pointing to these numbers, Israeli leftists argue that the creation of a separate Palestinian state is the only way to guarantee the "Jewishness" of the Jewish state. On the Israeli right, the numbers have generated discussion of cruder measures. Among them, large transfers of Palestinians to neighboring Arab states, sufficiently crippling the instruments of Palestinian self-rule so that it poses no threat to Jewish domination, or imposing a "Chinese rule" that strictly limits the number of children Palestinian couples may have.

Many Palestinian politicians, on the other hand, are heartened by the statistics, thinking that if they just hang tough, time is on their side. As the present crisis worsens in the occupied territories, the Palestinian population, especially its men, cling to this straw.

"When we used to have land, we had many children to help with the work. Now we are having many children to help us recover our land," said Muhammad Nofal, 45, an unemployed driver who has seven children. He and his family live in the Shufat refugee camp, on the outskirts of Jerusalem.

"I have six sons, three for the struggle and three for me," he said, echoing the words of Arafat, who famously
60  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Runs in the family. on: July 31, 2014, 09:43:57 AM
Incompetence and anti-Semitism.  And...

Of course.  A rapid defense on Huffington Post.  Could anyone imagine the outcry if a Conservative slipped and said what was on her mind about a guest.   Taking this into context one must remember that her father is a definite Jew hater from the Carter years.  Perhaps she will apologize and of course bygones will be bygones.  As long as she is a liberal we know her heart is in the right place  wink:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/07/30/mika-morning-jew-joe_n_5633478.html
61  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Cognitive Dissonance of His Glibness on: July 31, 2014, 08:35:37 AM
Why would anybody trust the US again?  We abandoned Iraqis who helped us just like we abandoned the Kurds and just like we abandoned S. Vietnamese who helped us.


Shimon Peres on CNN saying he trusts Obama and Kerry?  Oh common!   Give me a break. 

62  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / surgeon posts before and after pictures of patient on: July 31, 2014, 08:32:25 AM
I agree this is outrageous that this guy uses pictures of a patient to promote himself.  How dare him!
That said who the heck would have had any clue who this woman was?  Now we all know who she is. 

http://www.thesmokinggun.com/documents/doctor-sued-over-cocaine-nose-photos-687321
63  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Re: Issues in the American Creed (Constitutional Law and related matters) on: July 31, 2014, 07:55:49 AM
This makes the legal argument for the case.

I am not sure about the practical or political wisdom of this. 

To me it seems more a ploy to try to appease Conservatives (aka Boehner using this to show case that he IS standing up to the self Chosen one).   Would this not take more than a year or longer.  By then we will have several million more illegals in the US (actually now that I think of it immigration is not even in the law suit - oh my God - what a mea culpa!).

Levin doesn't think it will work.  Not that he is always right and many would argue not politically strategically helpful but he understands these things a ton more than me.

64  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Media Issues on: July 30, 2014, 11:27:34 PM
"Gamechanger Salon is comprised of “experienced change makers from different ‘worlds’ of the movement to share stories, honest reflections, interesting articles, and provocative ideas on how we build a stronger, more coordinated, more game-changing movement for the 21st Century” according to the policy manual"

Who the hell are these people and who asked them to change our "world" and what the hell are they to decide what is best for the rest of us.

Again the disease *narcissistic liberalism*.  They are so impressed with their own intelligence.  They know better then most in the world and they are going to fix it.   The ignorant "masses" just don't know better.  We need their help.  We just don't know it.

And what does this exactly mean:

*experienced change makers"

you mean progandists, deceivers, manipulators, divide and conquer, fascists, bribers, extortionists, con artists, snake oil salesmen?

65  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: US Economics, the stock market , and other investment/savings strategies on: July 30, 2014, 11:16:08 PM
Stockman is right.  And what does 40% of the voting public want to do about the wealth gap?

Tax the "rich" which also includes much of the middle class, to pay for all their debts. Continue the war on savings as Crafty apply puts it, "welcome" 5 million more poor illegals on top of the 12 million already here, and then all their relatives turning the rest of the country into Kalifornia (NJ too), punish the energy sector as Doug pointed out is the most thriving sector of all, embolden our enemies, piss off our friends, divide the nation even more and blame the other side, call them "haters" as the first Black and stooge in office does, all the while it is their policies worsening this mess.

But yes gotta support that brockster and the rest of the "for the po crowd".
The democrats in lock step eternally pushing *forward*  destroying America.

66  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / I am one American Jew this guy does not speak for on: July 30, 2014, 07:41:41 PM
Proving that he suffers from the mental disorder called *narcissistic liberalism* please read on.  Lets rally around this guy and self flagellate ourselves till we are all murdered and still blame ourselves for it.   

Every time I feel proud of being a Jew I hear or read about this crap and think of only disgust, embarrassment, and shame.
Do other conservative Jews feel this way? 

****a daily independent global news hour

with Amy Goodman & Juan González

Henry Siegman, Leading Voice of U.S. Jewry, on Gaza: "A Slaughter of Innocents"

Henry Siegman, president of the U.S./Middle East Project. He is the former executive director of the American Jewish Congress from 1978 to 1994 and former executive vice president of the Synagogue Council of America.

Read: “Israel Provoked This War.” By Henry Siegman (Politico)

Given his background, what American Jewish leader Henry Siegman has to say about Israel’s founding in 1948 through the current assault on Gaza may surprise you. From 1978 to 1994, Siegman served as executive director of the American Jewish Congress, long described as one of the nation’s "big three" Jewish organizations along with the American Jewish Committee and the Anti-Defamation League. Born in Germany three years before the Nazis came to power in 1933, Siegman’s family eventually moved to the United States. His father was a leader of the European Zionist movement that pushed for the creation of a Jewish state. In New York, Siegman studied the religion and was ordained as an Orthodox rabbi by Yeshiva Torah Vodaas, later becoming head of the Synagogue Council of America. After his time at the American Jewish Congress, Siegman became a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. He now serves as president of the U.S./Middle East Project. In the first of our two-part interview, Siegman discusses the assault on Gaza, the myths surrounding Israel’s founding in 1948, and his own background as a German-Jewish refugee who fled Nazi occupation to later become a leading American Jewish voice and now vocal critic of Israel’s policies in the Occupied Territories.

"When one thinks that this is what is necessary for Israel to survive, that the Zionist dream is based on the repeated slaughter of innocents on a scale that we’re watching these days on television, that is really a profound, profound crisis — and should be a profound crisis in the thinking of all of us who were committed to the establishment of the state and to its success," Siegman says. Responding to Israel’s U.S.-backed claim that its assault on Gaza is necessary because no country would tolerate the rocket fire from militants in Gaza, Siegman says: "What undermines this principle is that no country and no people would live the way that Gazans have been made to live. … The question of the morality of Israel’s action depends, in the first instance, on the question, couldn’t Israel be doing something [to prevent] this disaster that is playing out now, in terms of the destruction of human life? Couldn’t they have done something that did not require that cost? And the answer is, sure, they could have ended the occupation."



Transcript


This is a rush transcript. Copy may not be in its final form.

NERMEEN SHAIKH: As we continue our coverage of the Israeli offensive in Gaza, we spend the rest of the hour with Henry Siegman, the former executive director of the American Jewish Congress, long described as one of the nation’s "big three" Jewish organizations along with the American Jewish Committee and the Anti-Defamation League. Henry Siegman was born in 1930 in Frankfurt, Germany. Three years later, the Nazis came to power. After fleeing Nazi troops in Belgium, his family eventually moved to the United States. His father was a leader of the European Zionist movement, pushing for the creation of a Jewish state. In New York, Henry Siegman studied and was ordained as an Orthodox rabbi by Yeshiva Torah Vodaas. He later became head of the Synagogue Council of America. After his time at the American Jewish Congress, Siegman became a senior fellow at the Council on Foreign Relations. He now serves as president of the U.S./Middle East Project.

AMY GOODMAN: Over the years, Henry Siegman has become a vocal critic of Israel’s policies in the Occupied Territories and has urged Isral to engage with Hamas. He has called the Palestinian struggle for a state, quote, "the mirror image of the Zionist movement" that led to the founding of Israel in 1948. He recently wrote a piece for Politico headlined "Israel Provoked This War." Nermeen Shaikh and I sat down with him on Tuesday. I started by asking Henry Siegman if he could characterize the situation in Gaza at the moment.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Yes, it’s disastrous. It’s disastrous, both in political terms, which is to say the situation cannot conceivably, certainly in the short run, lead to any positive results, to an improvement in the lives of either Israelis or Palestinians, and of course it’s disastrous in humanitarian terms, the kind of slaughter that’s taking place there. When one thinks that this is what is necessary for Israel to survive, that the Zionist dream is based on the slaughter of—repeated slaughter of innocents on a scale that we’re watching these days on television, that is really a profound, profound crisis—and should be a profound crisis—in the thinking of all of us who were committed to the establishment of the state and to its success. It leads one virtually to a whole rethinking of this historical phenomenon.


NERMEEN SHAIKH: What do you believe—Mr. Siegman, what do you believe the objectives of Israel are in this present assault on Gaza?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, they have several objectives, although I’m not sure that each of them is specifically responsible for the carnage we’re seeing now. It has what seems on the surface a justifiable objective of ending these attacks, the rockets that come from Gaza and are aimed—it’s hard to say they’re aimed at civilians, because they never seem to land anywhere that causes serious damage, but they could and would have, if not for luck. So, on the face of it, Israel has a right to do what it’s doing now, and, of course, it’s been affirmed by even president of the United States, repeatedly, that no country would agree to live with that kind of a threat repeatedly hanging over it.


But what he doesn’t add, and what perverts this principle, undermines the principle, is that no country and no people would live the way Gazans have been made to live. And consequently, this moral equation which puts Israel on top as the victim that has to act to prevent its situation from continuing that way, and the Palestinians in Gaza, or Hamas, the organization responsible for Gaza, who are the attackers, our media rarely ever points out that these are people who have a right to live a decent, normal life, too. And they, too, must think, "What can we do to put an end to this?"


And this is why in the Politico article that you mentioned, I pointed out the question of the morality of Israel’s action depends, in the first instance, on the question: Couldn’t Israel be doing something in preventing this disaster that is playing out now, in terms of the destruction of human lives? Couldn’t they have done something that didn’t require that cost? And the answer is: Sure, that they could have ended the occupation, with results—whatever the risks are, they certainly aren’t greater than the price being paid now for Israel’s effort to continue and sustain permanently their relationship to the Palestinians.


AMY GOODMAN: When you say that Israel could end the violence by ending the occupation, Israel says it does not occupy Gaza, that it left years ago. I wanted to play a clip for you from MSNBC. It was last week, and the host, Joy Reid, was interviewing the Israeli spokesperson, Mark Regev.




MARK REGEV: Listen, if you’ll allow me to, I want to take issue with one important word you said. You said Israel is the occupying authority. You’re forgetting Israel pulled out of the Gaza Strip. We took down all the settlements, and the settlers who didn’t want to leave, we forced them to leave. We pulled back to the 1967 international frontier. There is no Israeli occupation of the Gaza Strip. We haven’t been there for some eight years.



AMY GOODMAN: Henry Siegman, can you respond?


HENRY SIEGMAN: OK, yeah. That is of course utter nonsense, and for several reasons. First of all, Gaza is controlled completely, like the West Bank, because it is totally surrounded by Israel. Israel could not be imposing the kind of chokehold it has on Gaza if it were not surrounding, if its military were not surrounding Gaza, and not just on the territory, but also on the air, on the sea. No one there can make a move without coming into contact with the Israeli IDF, you know, outside this imprisoned area where Gazans live. So, there’s no one I have encountered, who is involved with international law, who’s ever suggested to me that in international law Gaza is not considered occupied. So that’s sheer nonsense.


But there’s another point triggered by your question to me, and this is the propaganda machine, and these official spokespeople will always tell you, "Take a look at what kind of people these are. Here we turned over Gaza to them. And you’d think they would invest their energies in building up the area, making it a model government and model economy. Instead, they’re working on rockets." The implication here is that they, in effect, offered Palestinians a mini state, and they didn’t take advantage of it, so the issue isn’t really Palestinian statehood. That is the purpose of this kind of critique.


And I have always asked myself, and this has a great deal to do with my own changing views about the policies of governments, not about the Jewish state qua Jewish state, but of the policies pursued by Israeli governments and supported—you know, they say Israel is a model democracy in the Middle East, so you must assume—the public has to assume some responsibility for what the government does, because they put governments in place. So, the question I ask myself: What if the situation were reversed? You know, there is a Talmudic saying in Pirkei Avot, The Ethics of the Fathers: "Al tadin et chavercha ad shetagiah lemekomo," "Don’t judge your neighbor until you can imagine yourself in his place." So, my first question when I deal with any issue related to the Israeli-Palestinian issue: What if we were in their place?


What if the situation were reversed, and the Jewish population were locked into, were told, "Here, you have less than 2 percent of Palestine, so now behave. No more resistance. And let us deal with the rest"? Is there any Jew who would have said this is a reasonable proposition, that we cease our resistance, we cease our effort to establish a Jewish state, at least on one-half of Palestine, which is authorized by the U.N.? Nobody would agree to that. They would say this is absurd. So the expectations that Palestinians—and I’m speaking now about the resistance as a concept; I’m not talking about rockets, whether they were justified or not. They’re not. I think that sending rockets that are going to kill civilians is a crime. But for Palestinians to try, in any way they can, to end this state of affair—and to expect of them to end their struggle and just focus on less than 2 percent to build a country is absurd. That is part of—that’s propaganda, but it’s not a discussion of either politics or morality.


NERMEEN SHAIKH: One of the things that’s repeated most often is, the problem with the Palestinian unity government is, of course, that Hamas is now part of it, and Hamas is considered a terrorist organization by Israel and also by the United States. I’d just like to read you a short quote from an article that you wrote in 2009 in the London Review of Books. You said, "Hamas is no more a 'terror organisation' ... than the Zionist movement was during its struggle for a Jewish homeland. In the late 1930s and 1940s, parties within the Zionist movement resorted to terrorist activities for strategic reasons." Could you elaborate on that and what you see as the parallels between the two?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, I’m glad I said that. In fact, I repeated it in a letter to The New York Times the other day, a week or two ago. The fact is that Israel had, pre-state—in its pre-state stage, several terrorist groups that did exactly what Hamas does today. I don’t mean they sent rockets, but they killed innocent people. And they did that in an even more targeted way than these rockets do. Benny Morris published a book that is considered the Bible on that particular period, the war of—


AMY GOODMAN: The Israeli historian.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Sorry?


AMY GOODMAN: The Israeli historian, Benny Morris.


HENRY SIEGMAN: The Israeli historian, right, then in the book Righteous Victims, in which he said—I recall, when I read it, I was shocked—in which he—particularly in his most recently updated book, which was based on some new information that the Israel’s Defense—the IDF finally had to open up and publish, that Israeli generals received direct instructions from Ben-Gurion during the War of Independence to kill civilians, or line them up against the wall and shoot them, in order to help to encourage the exodus, that in fact resulted, of 700,000 Palestinians, who were driven out of their—left their homes, and their towns and villages were destroyed. This was terror, even within not just the terrorist groups, the pre-state terrorists, but this is within the military, the Israeli military, that fought the War of Independence. And in this recent book, that has received so much public attention by Ari—you know, My Promised Land.


AMY GOODMAN: Shavit.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Ari Shavit. He describes several such incidents, too. And incidentally, one of the people who—according to Benny Morris, one of the people who received these orders—and they were oral orders, but he, in his book, describes why he believes that these orders were given, were given to none other than Rabin, who was not a general then, but he—and that he executed these orders.


AMY GOODMAN: Meaning?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Meaning?


AMY GOODMAN: What did it mean that he executed these orders, Rabin?


HENRY SIEGMAN: That he executed civilians. And the rationale given for this when Shavit, some years ago, had an interview with Benny Morris and said to him, "My God, you are saying that there was deliberate ethnic cleansing here?" And Morris said, "Yes, there was." And he says, "And you justify it?" And he said, "Yes, because otherwise there would not have been a state." And Shavit did not follow up. And that was one of my turning points myself, when I saw that. He would not follow up and say, "Well, if that is a justification, the struggle for statehood, why can’t Palestinians do that? What’s wrong with Hamas? Why are they demonized if they do what we did?"


AMY GOODMAN: I want to go to the Israeli prime minister earlier this month, Benjamin Netanyahu, vowing to punish those responsible for the killing of Mohammed Abu Khdeir, the Palestinian teen who was burned alive following the murders of three Israeli teens. But in doing so, Netanyahu drew a distinction between Israel and its neighbors in how it deals with, quote, "murderers."




PRIME MINISTER BENJAMIN NETANYAHU: I know that in our society, the society of Israel, there is no place for such murderers. And that’s the difference between us and our neighbors. They consider murderers to be heroes. They name public squares after them. We don’t. We condemn them, and we put them on trial, and we’ll put them in prison.



AMY GOODMAN: That was Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu talking about the difference. Henry Siegman, can you respond?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, the only difference I can think of is that in Israel they made the heads of the two major pre-state terrorist groups prime ministers. So this distinction he’s drawing is simply false; it’s not true. The heads of the two terrorist groups, which incidentally, again, going back to Benny Morris, in his book, Righteous Victims, he writes, in this pre-state account, that the targeting of civilians was started by the Jewish terrorist groups, and the Arab—and the Arab groups followed.


AMY GOODMAN: You’re talking about Irgun and the Stern Gang.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Yes, yes. And as you know, both the head of the Irgun and both the head of the Stern Gang—I’m talking about Begin and Shamir—became prime ministers of the state of Israel. And contrary to Netanyahu, public highways and streets are named after them.

AMY GOODMAN: Henry Siegman, former head of the American Jewish Congress. We’ll continue our conversation with him in a minute.

[break]

AMY GOODMAN: This is Democracy Now!, democracynow.org, The War and Peace Report, as we continue our conversation with Henry Siegman, president of the U.S./Middle East Project, former head of the American Jewish Congress. I interviewed him Tuesday with Nermeen Shaikh.


NERMEEN SHAIKH: I’d like to turn, Henry Siegman, to Khaled Meshaal, the leader of Hamas, who was speaking to Charlie Rose of PBS. He said Hamas was willing to coexist with Jews but said it would not live, quote, "with a state of occupiers."




KHALED MESHAAL: [translated] I am ready to coexist with the Jews, with the Christians, and with the Arabs and non-Arabs, and with those who agree with my ideas and also disagree with them; however, I do not coexist with the occupiers, with the settlers and those who put a siege on us.


CHARLIE ROSE: It’s one thing to say you want to coexist with the Jews. It’s another thing you want to coexist with the state of Israel. Do you want to coexist with the state of Israel? Do you want to represent—do you want to recognize Israel as a Jewish state?


KHALED MESHAAL: [translated] No. I said I do not want to live with a state of occupiers.



NERMEEN SHAIKH: That was Khaled Meshaal, the leader of Hamas, speaking to Charlie Rose. Henry Siegman, could you respond to that, and specifically the claim made by Israelis repeatedly that they can’t negotiate with a political organization that refuses the state of Israel’s right to exist in its present form?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Yes. It so happens that in both international custom and international law, political parties, like Hamas, are not required or even ever asked to recognize states, whether they recognize a state or not. The question is whether the government of which they are a part and that makes policy and executes policy, whether that government is prepared to recognize other states. And this is true in the case of Israel, as well, the government of Israel, any government. I, incidentally, discussed this with Meshaal, not once, but several times, face to face, and asked him whether he would be part of a government that recognizes the state of Israel, and he says—and he said, "Yes, provided"—they had a proviso—he said, "provided that the Palestinian public approves that policy." And he repeated to me the fact that—he said, "You’re absolutely right." He says, "People ask us will we recognize the state of Israel, and will we affirm that it’s legitimately a Jewish state." He said, "No, we won’t do that. But we have never said that we will not serve in a government that has public support for that position, that we will not serve in such a government."


But a more important point to be made here—and this is why these distinctions are so dishonest—the state of Israel does not recognize a Palestinian state, which is to say there are parties in Netanyahu’s government—very important parties, not marginal parties—including his own, the Likud, that to this day has an official platform that does not recognize the right of Palestinians to have a state anywhere in Palestine. And, of course, you have Naftali Bennett’s party, the HaBayit HaYehudi, which says this openly, that there will never be a state, a Palestinian state, anywhere in Palestine. Why hasn’t our government or anyone said, "Like Hamas, if you have parties like that in your government, you are not a peace partner, and you are a terrorist group, if in fact you use violence to implement your policy, as Hamas does"? So the hypocrisy in the discussion that is taking place publicly is just mind-boggling.


AMY GOODMAN: Henry Siegman, you’re the head, the former head, of one of the leading Jewish organizations, the American Jewish Congress.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Two of them, also of the Synagogue Council of America.


AMY GOODMAN: So, these are major establishment Jewish organizations. You said you went to see Khaled Meshaal, the head of Hamas, not once, but several times to meet with him. The U.S. government calls Hamas a terrorist organization. They will not communicate with them. They communicate with them through other parties, through other countries, to talk to them. Talk about your decision to meet with Khaled Meshaal, where you met with him, and the significance of your conversations.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, first of all, it should be noted that the U.S. has no such policy of not meeting with terrorist organizations. It has a policy of not meeting with Hamas. That’s quite different. We’re very happy to meet with the Taliban and to negotiate with them. And they cut off hands and heads of people, and they kill girls who go to school. And that didn’t prevent the United States from having negotiations with the Taliban, so that’s nonsense that we don’t talk to terrorist organizations. We talk to enemies if we want to cease the slaughter, and we’re happy to do so and to try to reach an agreement that puts an end to it. And why Hamas should be the exception, again, I find dishonest. And the only reason that we do that is in response to the pressures from AIPAC and, of course, Israel’s position. The largest caucus, parliamentary caucus, in Israel’s Knesset is called the caucus of Eretz Yisrael HaShlema, which the Likud leads.


AMY GOODMAN: Explain that in English, "the land of Israel."


HENRY SIEGMAN: An "eretz," in English—in English, it means the whole land of Israel. This is a parliamentary caucus, the largest caucus in the Knesset, which is totally dedicated to not permit any government to establish a Palestinian state anywhere in the land of Israel, headed by Likud, senior Likud members of Knesset, and headed—a party that is headed by the prime minister of Israel. And what boggles the imagination is that no one talks about this, no one points this out, and no one says, "How can you take these positions via Hamas if this is exactly what is going on within your own government that you are heading?"


NERMEEN SHAIKH: Henry Siegman, as you are far more familiar than most, the argument made by Israel and supporters of Israel is that what might be construed as a disproportionate response by Israel to Hamas has to do with the historical experience of the persecution of the Jews and, of course, the Holocaust. So how do you respond to those kinds of claims?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, I don’t accept that at all, because the lesson from the persecutions would seem to me—and certainly if you follow Jewish tradition, the lesson of those persecutions, we have always said, until the state of Israel came into being, is that you do not treat people in that kind of an inhumane and cruel way. And the hope always was that Israel would be a model democracy, but not just a democracy, but a state that would practice Jewish values, in terms of its humanitarian approach to these issues, its pursuit of justice and so on.


I have always felt that, for me, the Holocaust experience, which was important to me, since I lived two years under Nazi occupation, most of it running from place to place and in hiding—I always thought that the important lesson of the Holocaust is not that there is evil, that there are evil people in this world who could do the most unimaginable, unimaginably cruel things. That was not the great lesson of the Holocaust. The great lesson of the Holocaust is that decent, cultured people, people we would otherwise consider good people, can allow such evil to prevail, that the German public—these were not monsters, but it was OK with them that the Nazi machine did what it did. Now I draw no comparisons between the Nazi machine and Israeli policy. And what I resent most deeply is when people say, "How dare you invoke the Nazi experience?" The point isn’t, you know, what exactly they did, but the point is the evidence that they gave that decent people can watch evil and do nothing about it. That is the most important lesson of the Holocaust, not the Hitlers and not the SS, but the public that allowed this to happen. And my deep disappointment is that the Israeli public, precisely because Israel is a democracy and cannot say, "We’re not responsible what our leaders do," that the public puts these people back into office again and again.


AMY GOODMAN: You mentioned your experience as a Holocaust survivor. Could you just go into it a little more deeply? You were born in 1930 in Germany. And talk about the rise of the Nazis and how your family escaped.


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, I don’t consider myself a Holocaust survivor, in the sense that I was not in a concentration camp. But I lived under Nazi occupation. I was born in 1930, but the Nazis came to power in—I think in 1933. And shortly thereafter, we lived in Germany at the time. My parents lived in Germany, in Frankfurt. And they left. My father decided to give up a very successful business and to move to Belgium then, and on the assumption that Belgium was safe, that we would be escaping the Nazis. But in 1940, the Germans invaded Belgium, and they invaded France. That was in early 1940, I believe. And so, it’s a long story, but for the next—from that point on until February 1942, when we arrived, finally arrived in the United States.


And how my father pulled that off is a miracle; to this day, I don’t fully understand, because there were six children that he had to bring with him, and my mother, of course. We ran from place to place. First we were at Dunkirk, where the classic evacuation, memorable evacuation took place, and the French and the British soldiers withdrew to across the channel. We happened to find ourselves there at the time. And then we were sent back by the—when the Nazi troops finally caught up with us in Dunkirk, they sent us back to Antwerp. And then my father had connections with the police chief, because of his business interests in Antwerp before the Nazis came. He was tipped off the morning that we were supposed to be—the Gestapo was supposed to come to our house to take all of us away. And so we just picked up, and we managed to get to Paris. And from Paris, we crossed—we were smuggled across the border into occupied Vichy France, and we were there for about a year, again without proper papers and in hiding. Then we tried to cross into Spain. And we did, but when we arrived at the Spanish border, they finally closed the border and sent us back into France.


So, then we managed to get a boat to take us from Marseille to North Africa, where we were interned briefly in a camp in North Africa. And then the—what I believe was the last ship, a Portuguese, a neutral ship, taking refugees to the United States stopped in North Africa. We boarded that ship. And we were on the high seas for two months, because the Nazi subs were already busy sinking the ships that they encountered. So we had to go all the way around to avoid various Nazi submarine-infested areas.


So after two months on the high seas, we arrived in New York, where we were sent to Ellis Island, which was full of Bundists, who had been German Bundists, who were arrested and were being sent back to Germany. But as we walked into Ellis Island into that hallway, something I will never forget, "We’re in America at last!" And those Bundists were greeting each other in the hallway, "Heil Hitler!" So the "Heil Hitlers" that we were trying to escape in Europe was the first thing we encountered as we landed on Ellis Island.


AMY GOODMAN: And how did you end up becoming head of one of the country’s—or, as you said, country’s two major Jewish organizations? And what was your position on Zionism after World War II?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, my father was one of the leaders of European Zionism. He was the head of the Mizrachi in the religious Zionist movement, not just in Belgium, but in Western Europe. And the leaders, the heads, the founders of the Mizrachi—mayor of Berlin himself, Gold, many others—were guests in our house in Antwerp. And they used to take me on their knees and teach me Hebrew songs from Israel. So, I had—I was raised on mother’s milk, and I was an ardent—as a kid even, an ardent Zionist. I recall on the ship coming over, we were coming to America, and I was writing poetry and songs—I was 10 years old, 11 years old—about the blue sky of Palestine. In those days we referred to it as Palestina, Palestine.


And so, into adulthood, not until well after the ’67 War, when I came across—and I got to know Rabin and others, and I came across a discussion in which I was told by Israelis, by the Israeli people who I was talking to, government, senior government people, that they had an initiative from Sadat about peace and withdrawal and so on. And Rabin said, "But clearly, the Israeli public is not prepared for that now." And that hit me like a hammer. I always had this notion drilled into me that if only the Arabs were to reach out and be willing to live in peace with Israel, that would be the time of the Messiah. And the Messiah came, and the Israeli leadership said, "No, public opinion is not ready for that." And I wrote a piece then in Moment magazine—if you recall, it was published by Leonard Fein—and he made it a cover story, and the title was, "For the Sake of Zion, I Will Not Remain Silent." And that triggered my re-examination of things I had been told and what was going on on the ground.


NERMEEN SHAIKH: Prior to that, your sense had always been that if the Arabs reached out, there would be two states: Palestine and Israel.


HENRY SIEGMAN: I had no doubt about that. I mean, that was, you know, just a given, that we are sharing. The resolution said, you know, two states. The resolution, which Israel—the partition resolution, which Israel invoked in its Declaration of Independence, planted, rooted its legitimacy in that—it cited the Palestinian—the partition plan. But when someone these days says, "But there’s a partition plan that said that the rest of it, that was not assigned to Israel, is the legitimate patrimony of the Palestinian people," the answer given is, "Ah, yeah, but they voted they would not accept it, and the partition plan was never officially adopted." Well, why are you quoting it then in your Declaration of Independence, if you consider it to be null and void and not—anyway.


AMY GOODMAN: And the response of—or the slogan, the idea that was put forward so much in the founding of the state of Israel: Palestine is a land without people for a people without land?


HENRY SIEGMAN: Well, that was the common understanding and referred to repeatedly in Ari Shavit’s book and others, that the Zionist movement, at its very birth, was founded on an untruth, on a myth, that Palestine was a country without a people. And as he says, obviously—and he recognizes in his book that it was a lie. And therefore, from the very beginning, Zionism didn’t confront this profound moral dilemma that lay at its very heart. How do you deal with that reality? And as a consequence of that, one of the ways in which they dealt with it was to see to the expulsion of 700,000 people from their cities, from their towns and villages, and the destruction of all of them, which, to his credit, Ari Shavit writes about very painfully and honestly.

AMY GOODMAN: Henry Siegman, president of the U.S./Middle East Project. He’s the former executive director of the American Jewish Congress as well as the Synagogue Council of America. He recently wrote a piece for Politico headlined "Israel Provoked This War." We’ll link to it at democracynow.org. Tune in tomorrow for part two of our conversation with Henry Siegman, where he talks about U.S. support for Israel and U.S. media coverage.

By the way, Democracy Now! has a job opening. We have an opening for an on-air graphic designer and CG operator. Visit democracynow.org for more information.
67  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: US Economics, the stock market , and other investment/savings strategies on: July 30, 2014, 06:51:05 PM
Happy days are here again oh happy days are here again oh happy days are here again oh yeaaaaaaaahahhhh!!!!!!!!!

 wink

You wanna buy land in south central Florida?   grin
68  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / To Bigdog on: July 30, 2014, 06:49:01 PM
Do you have any thoughts as to the merits legally, politically, strategically, or practically on the GOP lawsuit against Obama?

Thanks in advance.
69  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Cognitive Dissonance of His Glibness on: July 28, 2014, 06:47:03 PM
"Must also point out though that he lost the House, will lose the Senate"

I dunno about the last part.  Just today Dick Morris on his radio show said the Republicans are not a lock on winning the Senate.  They need six.  Four states the Senate seats appear they will shift from Dem to Rep, but two more are tossups and two are looking like they are going to stay Democrat including Landrieu AGIAN!

"losing the media, lost public support"

Doug, I don't see him losing media at all.  As for public support I don't see that either.  Push comes to shove people will vote their wallets and he is buying off plenty of "folks".  You know the little boring people he is so fond of referring to.  tongue
70  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Post from the State and Municipal thread on: July 28, 2014, 06:56:37 AM
"He is saying to a lot of immigrants and other groups, you can differ with conservatives on one issue (or two or three) and still vote conservative to move the country (state) in a better direction.  Certainly Reagan did that in his day with a wide range of voters"

Yes Reagan granted amnesty to millions.  That backfired and the vast majority vote for the other party.  Indeed I doubt anyone thinks Reagan could possibly win California now.   

Obama is not a weak President.  He is a very strong President.  He is done everything he said he would.  Socialized medicine.  Towards the eventual universal single payer.  A powerful EPA with expanding regulations.  Putting coal out of business.  Almost the carbon tax.   Higher taxes.  Blame the rich while taking all their money in taxes and payoffs.

He is changing the electorate as fast as he can.   Turning us into a one party country like Reagan's state is now.

He is downsizing the military, retreating from foreign involvement.  Withdrawn support from Israel as much he can while most Jews will support him anyway.

Need I go on.

The only weak ones are the Republicans.  They can't even get their message straight.  Most of their leaders are fumbling around. 

Obama has indeed in affect checked out.  Why?  He is not disengaged.  His work is done.  He has put America on his and his liberal backers trajectory.   Now just sit back and tell the Republicans 'f' 'y', play golf, hobnob with the beautiful and interesting people, travel all over seeing the sites, eat all the world's best food and enjoy.

He 'f' us over pretty good if you asked me.

 
71  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Politics at the State & Municipal level on: July 28, 2014, 06:55:50 AM
My friend Doug writes,

"He is saying to a lot of immigrants and other groups, you can differ with conservatives on one issue (or two or three) and still vote conservative to move the country (state) in a better direction.  Certainly Reagan did that in his day with a wide range of voters"

Yes Reagan granted amnesty to millions.  That backfired and the vast majority vote for the other party.  Indeed I doubt anyone thinks Reagan could possibly win California now.  

Obama is not a weak President.  He is a very strong President.  He is done everything he said he would.  Socialized medicine.  Towards the eventual universal single payer.  A powerful EPA with expanding regulations.  Putting coal out of business.  Almost the carbon tax.   Higher taxes.  Blame the rich while taking all their money in taxes and payoffs.

He is changing the electorate as fast as he can.   Turning us into a one party country like Reagan's state is now.

He is downsizing the military, retreating from foreign involvement.  Withdrawn support from Israel as much he can while most Jews will support him anyway.

Need I go on.

The only weak ones are the Republicans.  They can't even get their message straight.  Most of their leaders are fumbling around.  

Obama has indeed in affect checked out.  Why?  He is not disengaged.  His work is done.  He has put America on his and his liberal backers trajectory.   Now just sit back and tell the Republicans 'f' 'y', play golf, hobnob with the beautiful and interesting people, travel all over seeing the sites, eat all the world's best food and enjoy.

He 'f' us over pretty good if you asked me.

  
72  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: California on: July 27, 2014, 04:14:28 PM
" I cannot say that a pro-amnesty position is not necessary to have a chance of winning."

We lose either way  cry
73  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Crafty, have you heard of this guy? on: July 27, 2014, 08:02:20 AM
Barry Goldwater 2.0: This candidate wants to redefine conservatism 

 By George Will 
 JewishWorldReview.com |    MENLO PARK, Calif.

Fifty Julys ago, up the road near San Francisco, in the unfortunately named Cow Palace, the Republican National Convention gave its presidential nomination to Arizona Sen. Barry Goldwater, who knew he would lose: Americans were not going to have a third president in 14 months. Besides, his don't-fence-me-in libertarian conservatism was ahead of its time. His agenda, however, was to change his party's national brand.

Today, in this state where one in eight Americans lives, and where Democratic presidential candidates can reap 55 electoral votes without spending a dime or a day campaigning, the Republicans' gubernatorial candidate has an agenda and spirit similar to Goldwater's. Neel Kashkari is not, as some careless commentary suggests, an anti-Goldwater, diluting the state party's conservatism. He is Goldwater 2.0, defining conservatism a half-century on.

He relishes "turning upside down" the parties' stereotypes. The Democratic candidate, 76-year-old Gov. Jerry Brown, is "the old white guy." Kashkari, the 40-year-old son of Indian immigrants, was born in 1973, the year before Brown was first elected governor. Brown is a child of the establishment — his father, Pat, California's 32nd governor, was defeated in 1966 by Ronald Reagan. Jerry Brown, California's 34th and 39th governor, is a government lifer, having been secretary of state, attorney general and Oakland's mayor when not unsuccessfully seeking a U.S. Senate seat and the presidency (three times).

Kashkari prospered in the private sector, a place as foreign to Brown as Mongolia. Born in Ohio, Kashkari studied mechanical engineering at the University of Illinois, came to California to work in the aerospace industry, then earned an MBA from Wharton, joined Goldman Sachs and landed a Washington job with a Goldman Sachs alumnus, Treasury Secretary Henry Paulson. As a treasury official during one of the most dangerous periods in America's economic history, from July 2006 to May 2009, Kashkari says: "I saw the best in our political system."



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He remembers that, with a liquidity-deprived financial system pushing the nation to the precipice of a depression, Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell simply said, "Of course we'll find a way to get this done." The politically perilous but nation-saving business of bailing out the banking system was done in days. "What other democracy in the world," Kashkari asks, "can move that fast to deal with a crisis?"

Just as McConnell's opponent in this year's Kentucky Republican primary execrated McConnell's finest hour, Kashkari's primary opponent vociferously deplored Kashkari's role as administrator of the Troubled Asset Relief Program (TARP). This opponent, a factually challenged fire-breather (of illegal immigration, he said, "We are in a war"), also said Kashkari supports sharia law. That would be peculiar for a Hindu who calls himself "a libertarian socially" (he is pro-choice and pro-same-sex marriage) and lives in Southern California's culturally relaxed Laguna Beach.





     

     




Today, California is a one-party state: Democrats have 2-to-1 majorities in both legislative chambers and account for 40 of 55 members of Congress. Republicans hold no statewide office and have only 28 percent of voters registered by party. All of this has something to do with these facts: California has the nation's highest income tax, sales tax and poverty rate (adjusted for the cost of living) and the second-highest gasoline tax. Only four states have higher unemployment rates. Kashkari says California's "U-6 unemployment rate" — which includes unemployed people seeking full-time jobs, part-time workers who want full-time jobs and people too discouraged to seek jobs — is above 16 percent.

Running against Brown requires discerning silver linings on black clouds. Kashkari says of polls showing Brown leading 52 percent to 32 percent: Well, 100 percent of Californians know who Brown is, so 48 percent are looking for an alternative.

Kashkari promises to derail Brown's obsession — the (at least) $68 billion San Francisco-to-Los Angeles bullet train. Brown has been silent about the recent court decision striking down the tenure system that entrenches incompetent public school teachers. The public likes the decision; teachers unions loathe it. Brown, Kashkari says dryly, has "multiple owners."

"If I get Jerry on a debate stage," Kashkari says, "anything can happen." That is true, as is this: Goldwater lost 44 states but won the future. His conservative cadre captured the GOP, which won five of the next six and seven of the next 10 presidential elections. If California becomes a purple state and Democrats can no longer assume its 20 percent of 270 electoral votes, Republicans nationwide will be indebted to the immigrants' son who plucked up Goldwater's banner of conservatism with a Western libertarian flavor.

• George Will Archives
74  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / prediction on: July 26, 2014, 05:44:36 PM
Nominees for the Democratic ticket will be:

Hillary for Prez
Elizabeth Warren for V Prez

Can only one imagine the liberal and their MSM hoopla over this?

They will trumpet this as the seminal turning point in human civilization.
75  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / 2nd post today on this thread on: July 24, 2014, 09:38:40 AM
Howard said,

"If you’re anti-Israel, then you’re anti-America. It’s the only democracy over there"

I say, when one thinks of the Israel haters and liberals in general this statement fits quite well.

Excerpt from todays news release:


Howard Stern Gives Impassioned Defense of Israel


"If you’re anti-Israel, then you’re anti-America. It’s the only democracy over there, it’s the only friend we have who’s willing to fight and stand up for what’s right."

7.24.2014 |
 
When a caller attempted to blame Israel for the war with Hamas last week, SiriusXM radio host Howard Stern told him to “F*** off!” and then launched into an impassioned defense of Israel, saying “If you’re anti-Israel, then you’re anti-America” and arguing that Israel is “the only friend we have who’s willing to fight and stand up for what’s right.”   

The tense exchange began when the caller predicted that Stern would turn his back on Israel when Comedy Central host John Oliver was in the studio.

Stern: I’m not gonna change my tune. Israel’s at no fault.

Caller: Israel’s is at fault, actually.

Stern: F*** off!

The caller then claimed that “Zionists run Israel,” at which point Stern cut him off:

Stern:  Oh, f*** off... I don’t want to listen to any anti-Semitism today. Jews get enough s**t all over the world. They get s**t on all the time. Jews are the indigenous people of that area. I’m sick of the bulls**t. And the Arabs don’t even want those Palestinians, otherwise they’d let them matriculate into their country.

Stern eventually ended the call, saying, “you sicken me,” but added that being anti-Israel worked against the interests of America:


Stern: If you’re anti-Israel, then you’re anti-America. It’s the only democracy over there, it’s the only friend we have who’s willing to fight and stand up for what’s right.

After admitting that he lost his cool and let the caller “get under my skin,” he said he’s tired of reading “this bulls**t,” citing Pink Floyd’s anti-Israel Roger Waters, who he said “ought to shut his mouth too.” Stern then said that the problem was people were forgetting the history of Israel:

Stern: People forget history. Jews were being executed and killed, and they went over to Israel, this little sh*thole, which was a desert—it had nothing going on. 

Stern compared the drastic difference of the median income of Israelis, $30 thousand, and Palestinians, $2 thousand, as an example of the success of Israel despite living in the same region. He then pointed to the Palestinians' real problem: "They elected terrorists to run their country."

Stern: But the Palestinians are mad at the Israelis, instead of being mad at the f***ing terrorists running their so-called country—who are raping the country, taking all the aide the United States actually gives to them. That they’re not angry with; they’re angry with Israel. [...] They elected terrorists to run their country. That’s the difference. Who do you support? Get off your f***ing high horse
76  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Israel, and its neighbors on: July 24, 2014, 09:01:34 AM
Hats off to former Mayor Bloomberg - a first tip to him from me.

Perhaps the Jewish organizations are working behind the scenes?

If not then "where are the Jewish organizations" is a good question.

Rush said on the air yesterday that for the 80 % of Jews liberalism trumps everything else.

I have put it another way for years.  The Democrat Party is the new religion for 75-80% of American Jews.

Hand in hand also goes the statement that 'Republicans' are worse than Hamas, or Nazis.  For them Republicans are the lowest scum on the Earth.  Hatred for conservatives is palpable. 

Jews will not condemn their new chosen one - no matter what.  They will not.  Why?  Because then Republicans win.

This cannot happen.   Even though I am with the 20% who are conservative I still understand their thinking.

For example, we always hear libs verbally criticizing Bush for getting us into war in Iraq.  
In contrast when was the last time anyone heard any liberal let alone Jewish liberals criticizing LBJ for Vietnam.   I don't think I ever have.   

What they do do is link Nixon to Vietnam.   Notice the bait and switch all because of the Presidents party affiliation?

They will never criticize Obama.   *Maybe a tad*, and only *indirectly* once his reign is over, and their new chosen one (so far Hillary) is safely elected.

It is all psychiatric.  In my view a bit of a disease.  

If I was writing the psychiatric DSM manuels I would certainly have a disease category for liberalism.
77  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Immigration issues on: July 21, 2014, 10:02:14 PM
DDF writes,
"Mexico is racist as hell, much more so than the Black and White bickering in the States, but it isn't politically correct to report that there."

What are the racial groups in Mexico?  You mean light skin Mexicans vs darker Indians?

What is the reason so many are coming across now?   This cannot be without complicit help from US amnesty groups and I don't believe for one second Bama didn't see this coming and is not encouraging on different levels.

Your take?
78  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Immigration issues on: July 20, 2014, 05:24:14 PM
Thank you for your clarification from the front lines.   So who is helping these people over the border?
Non cartel opportunists?
Or are most just hitching rides across the journey from Central America and Mexico?
79  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Cognitive Dissonance of His Glibness on: July 20, 2014, 05:16:24 PM
"The flaw in Newt's piece is that he assumes Obama wants America to be America, that he wants America to succeed"

There is something about establishment Republicans, of which Newt is one, that they either will not or cannot accept this proposition.  They keep proclaiming he is weak or incompetent or well intentioned but just plain wrong.  But reasons or reason unclear to me they are unwilling to speak the real truth.   

And to me, that says the establishment Right is weak.
80  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Gertz: China making intercontinental hypersonic missles. on: July 20, 2014, 12:32:02 AM
"A line drawing of the scramjet-powered vehicle shows that the concept being studied for eventual construction is nearly identical to an experimental National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) scramjet vehicle called the X-43."

Duh how'd that happen?  cry Anyway the article:

****Report Reveals Chinese Military Developing New Scramjet-Powered Hypersonic Missile

BY:  Bill Gertz   
July 9, 2014 5:00 am

China’s military is working on a jet-powered hypersonic cruise missile in addition to an advanced high-speed glide warhead that was tested earlier this year.

A Chinese technical journal disclosed new details of research on what China’s defense researchers are calling a hypersonic cruise vehicle.

A line drawing of the scramjet-powered vehicle shows that the concept being studied for eventual construction is nearly identical to an experimental National Aeronautics and Space Administration (NASA) scramjet vehicle called the X-43.

Publication of details of work on the powered hypersonic cruise vehicle indicates China is pursuing a second type of ultra-fast maneuvering missile capable of traveling at speeds of up to Mach 10—nearly 8,000 miles per hour. Such speeds create huge technical challenges for weapons designers because of the strain on materials and the difficulty of control at high velocities.

Large numbers of Chinese military writings in recent years have focused on hypersonic flight. However, few have addressed scramjet powered hypersonic flight.

The Washington Free Beacon first disclosed Jan. 13 that China has conducted the first test of an unpowered hypersonic glide vehicle that U.S. intelligence agencies believe will be used to deliver strategic nuclear warheads through U.S. missile defenses.

The January test of the Wu-14 hypersonic vehicle signaled the beginning of what analysts say is the start of a new high-technology arms race to build high speed maneuvering strike vehicles.

The United States is developing both scramjet-powered and glide-hypersonic missiles. Russia’s government has made development of hypersonic missiles a priority.

The Chinese report outlines in technical detail how a scramjet-powered cruise vehicle operates at speeds greater than Mach 5 and discusses how to integrate airframe design with scramjet propulsion.

A scramjet is an engine that uses supersonic airflow to compress and combust fuel, creating a highly efficient propulsion system with few parts.

The report analyzed “preliminary design methods for airframe/engine integrative configuration.”

The analysis “may serve as a basis for quick preliminary design and performance evaluation of airframe/engine integrative configuration” for a future Chinese hypersonic cruise vehicle, the report said.

The scramjet cruise vehicle was described in a technical military journal called Command Control & Simulation. The article was published by the 716 Research Institute of the state-run China Shipbuilding Industry Corp., China’s largest maker of warships, submarines, and torpedoes.

Chinese drawing of hypersonic cruise missile Command Control & Simulation
Chinese drawing of hypersonic cruise missile / Command Control & Simulation

The study by China’s major naval weapons builder is a sign the PLA may be considering the strike vehicle for use against U.S. aircraft carriers and warships as part of what the Pentagon calls “anti-access, area denial” weapons.

China’s hypersonic weapons are among the most secret programs within the Chinese military, along with anti-satellite weapons and cyber warfare tools. However, China’s Defense Ministry confirmed the test asserting that it was “normal” scientific experiment and not aimed at any foreign state.

Military experts said the disclosure of the scramjet cruise missile is unusual and part of China’s large-scale high-technology arms buildup.

“China long ago identified hypersonics as a critical future military technology and has invested heavily in its development for future weapons,” said Rick Fisher, with the International Assessment and Strategy Center. “The old Bush administration concept of Prompt Global Strike using hypersonic non-nuclear warheads may be dormant in Washington, but it is very much alive and flourishing in Beijing.”

Fisher said a scramjet vehicle would have advantages over the Wu-14 glide vehicle, including better-sustained speeds, some maneuvering, and a depressed trajectory that would complicate efforts by U.S. missile defenses to intercept the ultra-fast maneuvering strike missile.

China’s Chengdu Aircraft Corporation has been leading the development of a hypersonic scramjet engine test platform similar to the decade-old Pentagon-NASA X-43, Fisher said.

Pentagon-NASA X-43 hypersonic scramjet powered vehicle NASA
Pentagon-NASA X-43 hypersonic scramjet powered vehicle / NASA

Fisher said the Chinese report does not make clear whether China is concentrating on scramjet power for future weapons. However, it could signal that researchers have made advances in such engines and materials.

Larry Wortzel, a former China-based military intelligence officer, said Chinese hypersonic arms are what Beijing calls “assassins’ mace” weapons that will give China a strategic edge in any future conflict with the United States.

“China is continuing with a number of programs to develop what Beijing considers to be ‘assassins’ mace’ weapons that defeat conventional defenses, including these hypersonic strike vehicles,” Wortzel said in an email. “The United States must move forward with its airborne and ship-borne laser programs and electromagnetic guns if we are to be able to counter China’s new weapons.”

U.S. hypersonic missile programs have been limited by the federal defense spending crisis that has constrained advanced weapons research.

Congress approved $70.7 million for an Army hypersonic missile program—an amount that is considered far less than what both China and Russia are investing in hypersonic arms.

Alan R. Shaffer, principal deputy assistant defense secretary for research and engineering, told a defense industry conference that a U.S. scramjet-powered hypersonic prototype, the X-51, is a leading choice for a military system of conventional rapid precision strike.

“We, the U.S., do not want to be the second country to understand how to have controlled scramjet hypersonics,” Shaffer said.

The Air Force Research Laboratory announced July 3 it will set up a new High Speed Experimentation Branch to study hypersonics at Arnold Air Force Base.

Russian Deputy Prime Minister Dmitry Rogozin said July 3 that Russian missile manufacturers must master the technology for both precision-guided and hypersonic weapons. Moscow has set a goal of 2020 to build its first hypersonic missile prototype.

The People’s Liberation Army (PLA), in a strategic review published last year, stated that new U.S. hypersonic weapons and other nations’ development of hypersonic arms pose a major threat to China’s national security.

The review said new weapons capable of striking land from space will have a “serious impact on national security.”

Among the weapons being developed by foreign powers, the Chinese military said, are “near space craft, spacecraft, and transatmospheric vehicles.”

It was the first time China mentioned the threat posed by the new generation of hypersonic threats in a public document. The report, “Strategic Review 2013,” was published by the PLA think tank Center for National Defense Policy.

It warned that “the role of space power is changing from information support, to space command operations and space-to-ground attacks.”

“The United States is intensifying the construction of its space confrontation capabilities and building a rapid responsive space system,” the report said, adding that the shift has begun from using space for support to ground attacks.

The report noted the U.S. development of near-space strike vehicles, including the X-51, a scramjet powered hypersonic vehicle developed by Boeing, the HTV-2, a glide strike vehicle, and the X-37 space plane launched atop a rocket. The PLA review called these weapons “new measures of power” and stated that they were “a bid to eliminate the boundary between air and space.”

Lee Fuell, a technical intelligence specialist at the Air Force National Air and Space Intelligence Center, told a congressional hearing in January that China’s hypersonic glide vehicle was a ballistic missile-launched system that glides and maneuvers to its target at speeds up to Mach 10 (about 7,611 mph).

Fuell said U.S. intelligence agencies believe that the glide vehicle is “associated with [China’s] nuclear deterrent forces.” Hypersonic strike vehicles also could be used for conventional precision-guided strikes, he said.

A Chinese-language version of article is available from the Canada-based Oriprobe information services.

This entry was posted in National Security and tagged China. Bookmark the permalink.
81  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Why is this racial? on: July 19, 2014, 11:44:44 AM
He was selling cigarettes so he has to be taken down by 5 officers including one in an MMA choke hold?

Ask the guy where he lives and send him a ticket.   That would have been more reasonable.
We have organized and white collar crime running amuck and this is what law enforcement wastes their time on?

But I don't see why the dirtball Sharpton has to do with this and why this is suddenly racial oppression:


http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/staten-island-man-dies-puts-choke-hold-article-1.1871486?utm_content=buffer96a7a&utm_medium=social&utm_source=twitter.com&utm_campaign=NYDailyNewsTw
82  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / France and Britain on: July 19, 2014, 11:28:18 AM
What would these Muslims do if they don't have Jews to kick around anymore?  Answer:

Christians and Hindus.

http://www.timesofisrael.com/tens-of-thousands-rally-in-london-against-israels-gaza-op/
83  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Not true? Or true? on: July 19, 2014, 11:20:52 AM

Climate Records Shattered in 2013
.


LiveScience.com
By By Becky Oskin, Senior Writer July 18, 2014 9:28 AM
 
Climate Records Shattered in 2013

Surface temperatures in 2013 compared to average temperatures since 1981.

If global warming could be compared to middle-age weight gain, then Earth is growing a boomer belly, according to a newly released report on the state of the global climate.

Climate data show that global temperatures in 2013 continued their long-term rising trend. In fact, 2013 was somewhere between the second- and sixth-hottest year on record for the planet since record keeping began in 1880, according to the climate report, released Thursday (July 17) by the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration (NOAA). (Four groups of scientists, who rely on slightly different methods to calculate global surface temperatures, ranked 2013 slightly differently compared with other years.)

The annual State of the Climate report compiles climate and weather data from around the world and is reviewed by 425 climate scientists from 57 countries. The report can be viewed online.

"You can think of it as an annual checkup on the planet," said Kathryn Sullivan, NOAA administrator.

And the checkup results show the planet ranged well outside of normal levels in 2013, hitting new records for greenhouse gases, Arctic heat, warm ocean temperatures and rising sea levels.

"The climate is changing more rapidly in today's world than at any time in modern civilization," said Thomas Karl, director of NOAA's National Climatic Data Center. "If we look at it like we're trying to maintain an ideal weight, then we're continuing to see ourselves put more weight on from year to year," he said.

Climate scientists blame rising levels of greenhouse gases, such as carbon dioxide, in the atmosphere for the planet's changing climate. The levels of carbon dioxide in Earth's atmosphere at Mauna Loa Observatory in Hawaii hit 400 parts per million (ppm) for the first time in 2013. The worldwide average reached 395.3 ppm, a 2.8 ppm increase from 2012, NOAA reports. (Parts per million denotes the volume of a gas in the air; in this case, for every 1 million air molecules, 400 are carbon dioxide.) [In Images: Extreme Weather Around the World]

"The major greenhouse gases all reached new record high values in 2013," said Jessica Blunden, a climate scientist with ERT, Inc., and a NOAA contractor who helped write the report.

Most parts of the planet experienced above-average annual temperatures in 2013, NOAA officials said. Australia experienced its warmest year on record, while Argentina had its second warmest and New Zealand its third warmest. There was a new high-temperature record set at the South Pole, of minus 53 degrees Fahrenheit (minus 47 degrees Celsius).

Here are the highlights from the report:
Sea level continued rising: Boosted by warm Pacific Ocean temperatures (which causes water to expand) and melting ice sheets, sea level rose 0.15 inches (3.8 millimeters), on par with the long-term trend of 0.13 inches (3.2 mm) per year over the past 20 years.
Antarctic sea ice hit another record high: On October 1, Antarctic sea ice covered 7.56 million square miles (19.5 million square kilometers). This beats the old record set in 2012 by 0.7 percent. However, even though the Antarctic sea ice is growing, the continent's land-based glaciers continued to melt and shrink.
Arctic sea ice low: The Arctic sea ice extent was the sixth lowest since satellite observations began in 1979. The sea ice extent is declining by about 14 percent per decade.
Extreme weather: Deadly Super Typhoon Haiyan had the highest wind speed ever recorded for a tropical cyclone, with one-minute sustained winds reaching 196 mph (315 km/h). Flooding in central Europe caused billions of dollars in damage and killed 24 people.
Melting permafrost: For the second year in a row, record high temperatures were measured in permafrost on the North Slope of Alaska and in the Brooks Range. Permafrost is frozen ground underneath the Earth's surface. The temperatures were recorded more than 60 feet (20 meters) deep.
Arctic heat: Temperatures over land are rising faster in the Arctic than in other regions of the planet. Fairbanks, Alaska, had a record 36 days with temperatures at 80 degrees Fahrenheit (27 degrees Celsius) or warmer. However, Greenland had a cooler than average summer.
Warm seas: Sea surface temperatures for 2013 were among the 10 warmest on record. Temperatures in the North Pacific hit a record high in 2013.

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84  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Drug cartel, illegal immigration, Democrat Party racket on: July 19, 2014, 09:48:00 AM
I don't believe most illegals are coming here just because of the reason they are escaping drug gangs but....

What a racket for the drug cartels!   Obviously all these people are not storming through Mexico without the help of drug cartels.  

Think of it.  They terrorize people in their countries then turn around and offer them asylum in the US, take 5 grand or God knows how much, then ship them up and dump them in the US while raping them along the way, enlisting some into their gangs, selling some of them, making some foot soldiers, maybe some work as drug mules and think of the money they make.  

What is $5,000 times just 100,000?   It comes to 500,000,000!!!!

And the Democrat party is complicit in this for the cynical reason of more Democrat votes.  

How *f" disgusting this all is.

We are funding drug cartels.   I mean we are already doing most of it already with all the *F* drug dealers and users in the US.
85  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Re: Music on: July 19, 2014, 09:35:58 AM
"I LOVE his rendition of Dylan's "Highway 61"!!!"

Yes!  1970?  Was he the main act or the opener then?  I think I got into him some years after.   Early to mid 70's.  I liked him better than his brother.

I had a couple of his albums.  My favorite was AND/LIVE though it was circa '75 when I first heard it in my fraternity during a party.  
86  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Contrast Krauthammer and Obama on: July 19, 2014, 09:31:49 AM
It is hard not to conclude the guy with the middle name Hussain is not an anti-Semite when one compares his stance and speeches to this simple and logical and true article by Krauthammer (disclosure:  a Jew - like me).

Unlike Obama the Terrible who on one side of his mouth spouts the phrase, "*I* agree Israel's right to defend itself" while at the same time undermining Israel and PM Netenyahu every step of the way in typical anti-Semitic fashion, Krauthammer makes (IMO) an excellent summary case of Israel's moral standing:

********
Charles Krauthammer
 
By Charles Krauthammer Opinion writer July 17   

Israel accepts an Egyptian-proposed Gaza cease-fire; Hamas keeps firing. Hamas deliberately aims rockets at civilians; Israel painstakingly tries to avoid them, actually telephoning civilians in the area and dropping warning charges, so-called roof knocking.

“Here’s the difference between us,” explains the Israeli prime minister. “We’re using missile defense to protect our civilians, and they’re using their civilians to protect their missiles.”

Rarely does international politics present a moment of such moral clarity. Yet we routinely hear this Israel-Gaza fighting described as a morally equivalent “cycle of violence.” This is absurd. What possible interest can Israel have in cross-border fighting? Everyone knows Hamas set off this mini-war. And everyone knows the proudly self-declared raison d’etre of Hamas: the eradication of Israel and its Jews.

Apologists for Hamas attribute the blood lust to the Israeli occupation and blockade. Occupation? Does no one remember anything? It was less than 10 years ago that worldwide television showed the Israeli army pulling die-hard settlers off synagogue roofs in Gaza as Israel uprooted its settlements, expelled its citizens, withdrew its military and turned every inch of Gaza over to the Palestinians. There was not a soldier, not a settler, not a single Israeli left in Gaza.

And there was no blockade. On the contrary. Israel wanted this new Palestinian state to succeed. To help the Gaza economy, Israel gave the Palestinians its 3,000 greenhouses that had produced fruit and flowers for export. It opened border crossings and encouraged commerce.

The Israel Defense Forces released a video on Thursday that they claim shows a tunnel that Hamas militants planned to use to attack Israel. (YouTube/The Israel Defense Forces)

The whole idea was to establish the model for two states living peacefully and productively side by side. No one seems to remember that, simultaneous with the Gaza withdrawal, Israel dismantled four smaller settlements in the northern West Bank as a clear signal of Israel’s desire to leave the West Bank as well and thus achieve an amicable two-state solution.

This is not ancient history. This was nine years ago.

And how did the Gaza Palestinians react to being granted by the Israelis what no previous ruler, neither Egyptian, nor British, nor Turkish, had ever given them — an independent territory? First, they demolished the greenhouses. Then they elected Hamas. Then, instead of building a state with its attendant political and economic institutions, they spent the better part of a decade turning Gaza into a massive military base, brimming with terror weapons, to make ceaseless war on Israel.

Where are the roads and rail, the industry and infrastructure of the new Palestinian state? Nowhere. Instead, they built mile upon mile of underground tunnels to hide their weapons and, when the going gets tough, their military commanders. They spent millions importing and producing rockets, launchers, mortars, small arms, even drones. They deliberately placed them in schools, hospitals, mosques and private homes to better expose their own civilians. (Just Thursday, the U.N. announced that it found 20 rockets in a Gaza school.) And from which they fire rockets at Jerusalem and Tel Aviv.

Why? The rockets can’t even inflict serious damage, being almost uniformly intercepted by Israel’s Iron Dome anti-missile system. Even West Bank leader Mahmoud Abbas has asked: “What are you trying to achieve by sending rockets?”

It makes no sense. Unless you understand, as Tuesday’s Post editorial explained, that the whole point is to draw Israeli counterfire.

This produces dead Palestinians for international television. Which is why Hamas perversely urges its own people not to seek safety when Israel drops leaflets warning of an imminent attack.

To deliberately wage war so that your own people can be telegenically killed is indeed moral and tactical insanity. But it rests on a very rational premise: Given the Orwellian state of the world’s treatment of Israel (see: the U.N.’s grotesque Human Rights Council), fueled by a mix of classic anti-Semitism, near-total historical ignorance and reflexive sympathy for the ostensible Third World underdog, these eruptions featuring Palestinian casualties ultimately undermine support for Israel’s legitimacy and right to self-defense.

In a world of such Kafkaesque ethical inversions, the depravity of Hamas begins to make sense. This is a world in which the Munich massacre is a movie and the murder of Klinghoffer is an opera — both deeply sympathetic to the killers. This is a world in which the U.N. ignores humanity’s worst war criminals while incessantly condemning Israel, a state warred upon for 66 years that nonetheless goes to extraordinary lengths to avoid harming the very innocents its enemies use as shields.

It’s to the Israelis’ credit that amid all this madness they haven’t lost their moral scruples. Or their nerve. Those outside the region have the minimum obligation, therefore, to expose the madness and speak the truth. Rarely has it been so blindingly clear.******
87  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Corruption on: July 19, 2014, 09:21:58 AM
Just another example of a "public servant" who was not a public servant but just an person planted in position for the march forward.

Perhaps the only difference between the usual corruption in government of nepotism, cover-ups, fraud, theft, people looking the other way, bribery, the few people with integrity who are threatened with their jobs to remain silent, etc is that the Obama people appear more led by shoving through one way or the other the liberal agenda.  Legally or illegally.  Ethically or unethically, right or wrong, unfair to some and favorable to others, and anyway other way they can dream of.
88  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Cognitive Dissonance of His Glibness on: July 19, 2014, 09:15:02 AM
"President Obama is rapidly becoming the weakest president since James Buchanan failed to stop the drift toward Civil War"

I disagree with this statement.   How can he be the "weakest President" yet have done so much to damage this country.  Thanks to him we have embarked on the first platform to full socialized single payer health care (United Kingdom as the role model), open borders, military draw down, increased centralized power of the executive branch and all the agencies it runs forcing through a widely political agenda, the strangulation of industries he wants to abolish, the fascist mix of companies that support him and he thus returns the favors by granting them preferential treatment and government money,  the abuse and getting away with using agencies to target political enemies, the near infliction of carbon tax that will devastate the economy raise prices and hurt the energy industry, the increased transfer of wealth, the explosion in entitlement spending,  and more.

Newt,  You got it wrong.  This is hardly the stuff of a "weak" President.  In these ways he has become one of the most powerful Presidents in our time.   

What he is; is the most anti-American President the most damaging President, the most imperial President, the most cynical,  the most divisive, the most ideological one we have ever seen.
89  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Way Forward for the American Creed on: July 19, 2014, 09:00:33 AM
Great article.  Jonah is evolving into one of the great writers and *thinkers* on the right.

He has excellent points.  I guess he is saying the Catholic Church and Orthodox Jewry should be more socially liberal yet still promote and uphold many traditional tenets.

This part below is hysterical and great.   grin Did he really come up with these electrically funny jokes:

****What is commonly called "political correctness" doesn't get the respect it deserves on the right. Sure, in the herstory of political correctness there have been womyn and cis-men who have taken their seminal ovulal ideas too far, but we should not render ourselves visually challenged to the fact that something more fundawomyntal is at work here.****
90  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Hillbillary Clintons long, sordid, and often criminal history on: July 19, 2014, 08:51:39 AM
"She spoke in terms of being proud of America and that we have a great story to tell and that we just have to tell it. "

And of course who better to tell it than her..... Sarcasm to the 10th degree!

I guess she has been listening to Glen Beck (the one of old), Sarah Palin, Rush Limbaugh, Marc Levin, Michael Savage, and many others on the right who have preached this throughout the progressive holocaust assault on America that has taken control of most of our media, Universities, unionized schools, and the entire Democrat party.

This is *classic* Clinton.  Steal the correct theme from the Right and act and promote it as though she discovered it and have her mafia organization now go all over the place promoting what they claim is her theme and the loving media will let her get away with it.  This is the classic Clinton way of infuriating us who know better.   (sadly it works for them)

The Right must NOT let her get away with this. ( However I know the Republican leadership does not have the savvy to do this)  She is a phony and a fraud.  All of us on this board know it.  Half the nation knows it.   Most on the left will always vote for her no matter what anyway.   Again it comes down to the minority who fall into the "some who can be fooled all of the time" (Lincoln of course).

 
91  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Re: Music on: July 17, 2014, 09:39:47 AM
Circa 2000 we went to see him at the House of Blues in Orlando (when we were leaving the house).  He was one of my favorites in college.  Unfortunately, he looked very sickly.  Someone said they thought he had aids.  He was injecting heroin so it is feasible that he also injected a deadly virus.  OTOH albinos sometimes have associated neurodegenerative disorders as well and for all I know it was this that made him appear the way he did.   We left the show early because frankly he was so weak and terrible that he could only repeat the same few chords while his band was obviously trying to compensate for his inability to play.  We thought he looked like he was going to die soon at that time so I am surprised he lasted till now.   He will be remembered for his "mean" guitar work.   His music struck a chord with me that is for sure:


Blues legend Johnny Winter dies at 70 in Zurich

Associated Press
By JOHN HEILPRIN 43 minutes ago

FILE - In this Friday, June 19, 2009 file photo, Johnny Winter plays during the Canton Blues Festival 2009 in downtown Canton, Ohio. Texas blues icon Johnny Winter, who rose to fame in the late 1960s and '70s with his energetic performances and recordings that included producing his childhood hero Muddy Waters, died in Zurich, Switzerland on Wednesday, July 16, 2014. He was 70. (AP Photo/The Repository, Bob Rossiter) MANDATORY CREDIT
   
GENEVA (AP) — Texas blues legend Johnny Winter, known for his lightning-fast blues guitar riffs, his striking long white hair and his collaborations with the likes of Jimi Hendrix and childhood hero Muddy Waters, has died. He was 70.

Winter was a leading light among the white blues guitar players, including Eric Clapton and the late Stevie Ray Vaughan, who followed in the footsteps of the earlier Chicago blues masters. Winter idolized Waters — and got a chance to produce some of the blues legend's more popular albums. Rolling Stone magazine named Winter one of the top 100 guitarists of all time.

His representative, Carla Parisi, confirmed Thursday that Winter died in a hotel room in Zurich a day earlier. The statement said his wife, family and bandmates were all saddened by the loss of one of the world's finest guitarists.

There was no immediate word on the cause of death.

Winter had been on an extensive tour this year that recently brought him to Europe. His last performance came Saturday at the Lovely Days Festival in Wiesen, Austria.

The tour, a documentary that premiered at the SXSW Festival exploring his music, youth and substance abuse battles, and a newly released four-CD set of recordings were all part of Winter's celebration of turning 70 this year.

John Dawson Winter III was born on Feb. 23, 1944, in Mississippi, but was raised in Beaumont, Texas. He was the older brother of Edgar Winter, also an albino, who rose to musical fame with the Edgar Winter Group.

Winter was one of the most popular live acts of the early 1970s, when his signature fast blues guitar solos attracted a wide following. But his addiction problems with heroin during that decade and later battles with alcohol and prescription medication, including methadone, also drew attention.

His career received a big boost early on when Rolling Stone singled him out as one of the best blues guitarists on the Texas scene. This helped secure a substantial recording contract from Columbia Records in 1969 that led to an appearance at the Woodstock Festival and gave him a wide following among college students and young blues fans.

Crowds were dazzled by the speed — and volume — of his guitar playing, which had its roots in urban blues but incorporated elements of rock 'in roll.

Winters paid homage to Waters on "Tribute to Muddy," a song from his 1969 release "The Progressive Blues Experiment." He continued to pick up accolades, producing three Grammy Award-winning albums for Waters and recording with John Lee Hooker, which helped revive their careers.

Winter performed often with blues and rock singer Janis Joplin and the two became close during the 1960s.

Among the blues classics that Winter played during that era were "Rollin' and Tumblin'," ''Bad Luck and Trouble" and "Good Morning, Little Schoolgirl." He also teamed up with his brother Edgar for their 1976 live album "Together."

He was inducted into the Blues Foundation Hall of Fame in 1988.

There was no immediate word on funeral services.

Gregory Katz contributed from London.
92  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / The culprit: Of course on: July 16, 2014, 09:36:37 PM
"climate change"  rolleyes

http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/sideshow/mysterious-260-foot-crater-discovered-in-remote-region-of-siberia-003800386.html
93  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Republican voter fraud on: July 16, 2014, 08:09:39 PM
The lawyer for state Sen. Chris McDaniel announced at a press conference on Wednesday afternoon in Jackson, MS, that he has enough evidence to file for an official challenge of the election results, and will do so in the coming days.


“The million dollar question: What did we find? We found a lot,” Mitch Tyner, of Tyner Law Firm, said after he and McDaniel supporter state Sen. Michael Watson walked the press and McDaniel supporters at the press conference through how they have serious concerns with the election review process in Mississippi.


“We’ve heard it our entire lives in Mississippi,” Tyner said. “Votes are being bought. Ballot boxes are being stuffed. There are false affidavit ballots. There are invalid affidavit ballots. There are invalid absentee ballots—we’ve heard it all our lives. I’m 51 years old and it’s the first time I saw it up close and personal. It exists. We are committed to finding it and rooting it out and stopping it.”


Tyner thanked Sen. Watson for standing up against alleged voter fraud and said Watson “can do something about it in the next legislative session.”


Tyner walked those at the press conference through how the McDaniel campaign’s attorneys, especially Sen. Watson, have been arguing before various courts in the state for judges to order election officials in a variety of Mississippi’s 82 counties for orders that they open election materials up for inspection. Every time, Tyner noted, the judges have sided with Watson’s arguments and order election officials to open the materials up for McDaniel campaign review.


The campaign is asking the Mississippi Supreme Court to rule on the matter so that the poll books and other election materials can be opened up to the McDaniel campaign for no charge. “That’s the issue that we want to make sure that the Supreme Court rules on: that it doesn’t matter how much money you have, you still get to look at the poll books,” Tyner said.


Tyner walked reporters through the “categories of information we’ve been finding” next.


“There’s crossover votes, we know that,” Tyner said. “There’s illegal votes—all types of illegal votes going on, absentee problems, votes that were cast—we’re going as far as into the boxes to see if how many people signed in are the same number that were cast. You’re going to be astonished. They aren’t. It’s amazing. You’re going to see problem after problem after problem.”


Tyner then addressed how Sen. Thad Cochran’s campaign and its supporters have said there’s no evidence in public yet, so there’s nothing there. “Am I going to sit right here and try my case in the media and do a tit-for-tat with the Cochran campaign?” Tyner asked rhetorically. “‘We found this but it says that.’ I’m not going to do that. We’re going to be mature about this.”


Tyner promised that soon, when the campaign files its challenge, it will publish all the evidence for the public to see. “We’re going to put it all together in a complete package,” Tyner said. “I was really hoping we’d have it today. Monday, a week ago, I was sure we would. But I wasn’t sure we were going to run into this many problems. We’re going to get that together and at the same time we file a challenge, we’re going to give you a complete copy of it.”


Tyner also told the reporters that he’ll be providing a copy of the evidence to federal and state law enforcement officials as well. “We’re not only going to give it to you guys in the media, we’re also going to give a copy of it to the U.S. Attorney, to the Federal Election Commission, and we’re also going to give it to the Attorney General of the State of Mississippi,” Tyner said to cheers from McDaniel supporters at the press conference.


Tyner said that this is “much bigger than” just differences between Cochran and McDaniel.


“I praise Chris for not throwing in the towel,” Tyner said. “The conventional wisdom is out there. Everyone knows he was a very popular candidate and everyone knows he could have conceded and written his ticket for any office next year. But Chris McDaniel said, ‘no, I want to root out the problems. I want to integrity in this process, and if it destroys my political career so be it.’ That’s the kind of candidate we need for every elected office in Mississippi as well as inside the beltway.”



When local reporter Scott Simmons asked them if they have enough evidence to file a legal challenge of the election, Tyner replied: “Yes. There’s already enough evidence to file the challenge.”

When Simmons followed up to ask if that evidence is entirely ineligible crossover votes—Democrats who voted in the June 3 Democratic primary then in the June 24 GOP primary runoff—Tyner responded that he’s “not going to go into the specifics of everything, but crossover votes are a big part of our challenge.”

94  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / The "time is now" again on: July 16, 2014, 05:48:21 PM
http://nj1015.com/tags/illegal-immigrants/
95  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Immigration issues on: July 15, 2014, 06:02:46 PM
Well of course he does.  It's been obvious since almost day one.   What does anyone think the conspiracy to allow as many to get here is all about.  Bring in as many hordes as possible and then pardon the whole bunch.   

Oh he just incompetent, he is really a good man, he is just taken by surprise, fools still proclaim............

He is not bored.  He is just sitting back and letting events unfold and waiting for the best political moment where he can with his actions (pardon), and not words, say F*Y* to half of America. 
Just like he did with his birth certificate. 
96  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Cognitive Dissonance of His Glibness on: July 15, 2014, 05:52:49 PM
"Let them eat cake"  fits to this president with regards how he contrasts himself to the "folks".
The man is not a socialist.  He is a king.

I would also replace 'cake' with lettuce and spinach and that would fit him perfectly.

His conceit, arrogance, self love, megalomania is so far off the charts one would have to add a separate page to draw the line high enough for him.

I might add I know of no great insight, no great thought, no great idea, no great plan, strategy, or discovery he has ever dreamt of.  He is just the front man.  All show and pomp.  Not stupid by any means.  But no great thinker.
97  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Energy Politics & Science on: July 13, 2014, 09:47:46 AM
Doug posts:

"Meanwhile, fracking has no known incidents of poisoning ground water, and (posted elsewhere) the $100 Billion Germany is investing in solar will the delay the final destruction of the planet by 38 hours, according to peer-reviewed, scientific models."

If we replaced all coal with natural gas I wonder how much we could delay the end of humanity by.

Instead the left wants solar, etc that won't work for the bulk of what we need.
98  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: Armed and Unarmed Resistance? on: July 13, 2014, 09:40:42 AM
"What do we think of this?"

Dunno.  But does vent frustration felt by many of us.

Democrats selling us out for votes.
Republicans selling us out for cheap labor.
Billionaires from both sides selling us out for cheap labor.
Church selling us out for new members.
Union bosses ( not members ) selling us out for new members to keep them in power and money.

People here legally are the ones who will suffer from this.  What about us?

Drudge reports some stories of American minorities starting to wake up to being sold down the river.

I reject any claims I am racist but one cannot drive around where I live and not see huge numbers of short American Indian looking people all over the place.  On the streets, riding bicycles, waiting for rides, going in and out of ERs, Ob floors, often with children in tow.   And probably the vast majority of these are illegals.  What about all the others from Europe, Africa, Caribbean, Asia, Middle East who blend in more who are amongst us that are less obvious?   What about them bringing over family members?

And people still say Obama is a nice guy?  Just incompetent, or misled?  rolleyes

He knows full well what is happening.   He will grant them amnesty before he leaves office.  He is truly a very angry bitter man.    
99  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Science, Culture, & Humanities / Yak meat - wow on the ingredients. on: July 13, 2014, 09:25:18 AM
Yahoo news mention of yak meat this morning so I look up the ingredients.   It is very low in fat, has omega 3, low sodium, very low calories, no carbs.   Now the question, does it taste good?

http://aboutyaks.com/health.html
100  Politics, Religion, Science, Culture and Humanities / Politics & Religion / Re: The Politics of Health Care on: July 05, 2014, 11:33:21 AM
"It’s unbelievable that we have reached a place in society where free marijuana is treated as a right for those who cannot afford to buy their own weed."

This says it all.   cry
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