Quite a video.  The entire episode appears to have been edited down to the throw and the punch, neither of which caused the victim of the assault any actual injury, according to the news report. It reminds me of a Gathering fight in which I thought my friend would be facing serious injury in a fight with a fellow more than twice his weight.  Why is it that we react in such a way to such a size difference ?

Wow, that sounds like fun.  Your sprints are a great start, as is Mr. Furman's circuit.

Overall, when it comes to sport-specific endurance, there's nothing like doing that sport.  I know it's hard to find training partners, and in their absence, you can just repeat the event around a heavy bag.  It's not the same, but if you stick to the schedule, you can at least have some mental experience with that ordeal.  The determinism of the event reduces the stress.  I practice spar with my friends and usually outlast them all.  My opinion is that only part of that is physical conditioning.  The rest is teaching your body what it must do.  It's kinda like running without a known endpoint.  The records skips on and on ... but really, I think there is a lot to be said for prior event experience.
 
As you probably know, you will lose a lot of water.  It's a good idea to drink enough beforehand, preferably with some of that Nuun salts.  Other sports drinks are more for recovery and their acidity will turn your stomach.  Sometimes, the dehydration get out of control and the chills set in.  I wish I knew more about how to prevent or mitigate that.

If you weren't in Hawaii, I would say that looks just like Linda Matsumi, known to have run over many an opponent like Cooper Mini.

Indris makes a special trip to the Gathering just to do the photography.  He has a conflict for June 2007 (possibly moving to New York), but perhaps I can get him to attend anyway.  It takes quite a bit of experience and guts to get on the mat with a bunch of crazy guys swinging sticks and you know you have to get close for any good pictures.

Greg,

Great account of your action.  I really enjoyed reading a modern account by someone I know of how these preparatory gestures help with self-defense in real situations.  Awesome.

Gints

Please tell me where to find this dune.  I'd really like to try it the next time I am down there for a Gathering. 

I don't think that martial arts systems passed on by those that have never used the techniques in real (combat, self-defense) or even semi-real (hard sparring)  represent the combat knowledge of all of time.   We can study and practice some of the techniques, but the further it is removed from personal experience, the more it resembles an enjoyable dance of repetition.

As you say, it would be a fine test of the Thornton's material against one of the most proficient stick fighters (Top Dog) we have known.  A more reliable task is to send a few students to a several of the Dog Brother Gatherings to gain some experience with people outside of their class.  An average response is a better gauge than a contest between two of the top players.  What good is a system if it is only suitable to the founder ?

A footwork detractor may also be the fighting and training surfaces.  Most boxers and kickboxers train on carpet, concrete and finally, a stretched-canvas ring.   Training on a hard surface develops the stretch reflex necessary for quicker movement.  The cushier surfaces kills that development and execution as well as providing a less stable surface.  I remember how much my feet/ankles wobbled at my first Gathering at the RAW gym with its extra cushy black mats, as most of my training had been on a concrete floor in sneakers or on a wooden floor (Kenpo) in shoeless. 

My Kenpo club holds a four hour belt ceremony workout on the beaches of Bodega Bay , north of San Francisco.   While the location is scenic, from a performance aspect, moving on slippery sand is difficult, and everyone moves slower, in part due to caution and in part due to fatigue.   There are often a few pulled groin muscles for those unaccostumed to working out on sand (probably all of us!), and that would cull away the older fighters.   This wouldn't make for a good showing.

I liked Phil's suggestion of working out in the river overflows.  That would make for a different gathering as folks would be less willing to go to the hard ground.   My group tried fighting in a river runoff pump station, and the cement wasn't too bad.

I also give my condolences.  I remember my first seminar with the Sayoc Kali clan at the Dog Brothers camp in summer 2002 and was impressed with the system.  I am sorry to read that GM Bo Sayoc has passed.

Excellent treatise, Mr. Brown.

In agreement, I also  believe that much of a post-fight reaction has to do with the intensity of the fight as well as the intensity of the preparation (training as well as fight day).  I have watched many fights that appear complacent, and to no surprise, the post-fight reaction is neutral.  An intense fight takes you to a mind/body place that you are generally to experience on your own, short of life-threatening situations.  When you're feeling the chills or holding back the puke, tears aren't far behind.  If the outcome of the fight doesn't concern you, the experience isn't a fight.

Also, the spectacle of exposing the fighter during his post-fight tension release is enough to start the flow tears.  It's almost as if the struggle to hold them back opens the floodgates.

Excellent job on the trailer for Grandfathers2.  The tension imparted by the videoclip was perfect.  I am eager to add this DVD to my collection. 

Yeah, this is the Systema guys again.  While the founder is a martial arts genius, all of the demos in this video give me that "aikido demo" feel in which the demo would never look as beautiful unless your opponents are from your own school.

> Spike has asked that you please avoid wearing t-shirts with corporate logos, basedball/football/basketball team logos

Logos can be covered up with duct tape.  Orchard Supply sells a variety of colors other than gray :  black, yellow, blue, red, vibrant green .

Woof Marc,

How do you search by username for this video ?  I tried to search by username and video name in the search box.  The only video that came up is some sort of kids in a pool video.

Thanks,

Gints

This is excellent coverage.  Congratulations Marc and Cindy.

I am sorry to read about the passing of Master Sonny Umpad.   He was a soft-spoken expert in his field.  Although I have only met him once and watched his teaching methods, I've had more exposure to his material living through his students. 

With deep respect,

Gints

The part where some credited our teachers wasn't included.  So, I'll credit my teachers here :

Much appreciation to my teachers for their patience and expert instruction:
Master Richard Lewis, Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo
Guro John Peterson, M.Suro Mike Inay, Suro Jason Inay, Guro Jena Inay, Guro Joe Tesoro, Inayan Eskrima
Teacher Vince Uttley , Eclectic blend of Eskrima,Silat,Kickboxing
Sigung John Bono, Bono JKD/Kajukenbo
And to Marc Denny for his Dog Brothers Gatherings

This is a national broadcast.  I saw the show, and the emphasis we placed on brotherhood through self-defense training came through.  I think there
is another show on Saturday June 03.

Check this link and click on your state :

http://www.geraldoatlarge.com/where-to-watch.php

Otherwise, check for the video in their archives:
http://www.geraldoatlarge.com/video-archive.php

Enjoy,

Gints

Watch the "Gentleman's Fight Club" on "Geraldo At Large" tonight
7:30pm Friday June 02
on KPIX/CBS 5 (channel 5)  
There may be another rebroadcast on Saturday.
http://www.geraldoatlarge.com/where-to-watch.php?stateCode=CA

Geraldo Rivera decided to do a show on geeks and sparring and
cold-called my group. I hope the spin isn't too crazy.   In the hours
of interviews, we all credited our martial arts teachers by name and
provided largely sane responses.   We are average fighters
with a good heart for self-defense training.  This story is about
showing the world why we enjoy self-defense training and the
comraderie of the group.

We mentioned the Dog Brother Gathering in LA during the interviews
and that this activity helps us train for that awesome event.
Hopefully, that blurb will make it into the show.  Thank you, Marc !

http://www.geraldoatlarge.com/blog.php?where_param=blog_id&blog_id=438

http://www.geraldoatlarge.com/blog.php?where_param=blog_id&blog_id=437&PHPSESSID=253e2d65c6dcfc9e3651490edacccb0e

The cans are of diet soda, of course,
inspired by the scene in the Sean Penn movie "Bad Boys" (1983) .
The flexible weapon is a towel tipped with a bar of Safeguard soap,
inspired by the scene in "Full Metal Jacket."
(Irish Spring leaves you smelling clean as a whistle while Dove leaves
your hands silky soft)

I was quite shocked to read that article.  The media spin
was faster than anything I would have guessed from the hour-long
phone interview and the observation of two sessions.

Here's the video for the story by the same news organization, AP, the Associated Press :
http://video.ap.org/v/en-ap/v.htm?g=2bada3c7-7672-4a55-95a6-1d6d0b74fe52&f=ap&fg=copy

I liked the "Interface" video.   The Imelda Marcos attack footage and wound footage really enhanced the delivery of the knife training instruction.  Excellent job !

Gints

Woof Crafty,

Are you holding the DB Gathering on June 6th (Tuesday) as you mentioned in a post on DBMAA ?  The link on the DB home page lists the date as June 25.

I'm psyched to participate in another awesome event.

Thanks !

Gints

Gloves of any kind are training equipment, as are rattan sticks.  It's difficult to find training partners that are willing to break their hands several times a week, so I think there is a place for wearing thick hockey gloves during training.   I do. With thick gloves, it's much more fun to practice hitting the hand.  Without such protection, it's difficult to collect an adequate number of repetitions of "defang the snake."

Gints

Show: http://cbs5.com/local/local_story_059005903.html

Awesome Preview :
http://www.cbs5.com/video/?id=11364@kpix.dayport.com

CBS San Francisco Chronicle ad:
http://web.newsguy.com/sting333/photos/GFC/MeetTheFace_GFC_Feb27_2006v2.jpg

Hey Ryan,

Nah, the coverage is limited to the San Francisco area.
Though, the producer told me that the show will be on
the www.cbs5.com site in a longer form.  I'm the fellow
swinging the toilet seat.  

Gints

The crazy preview :

http://www.cbs5.com/video/?id=11364@kpix.dayport.com

Check out the CBS5 program on a San Francisco Bay Area
sparring club  - the "Gentleman's Fighting Club ",
airing on CBS 5 (Channel 5) on Monday February 27, 2006
at 11pm .

Here is the CBS ad from the San Francisco Chronicle :

http://web.newsguy.com/sting333/photos/GFC/MeetTheFace_GFC_Feb27_2006v2.jpg

Also, here is an earlier piece from National Public Radio:
http://home.att.net/~gints/NPRpix.htm

Enjoy,

Gints

I study Kajukenbo under two teachers:  my long time teacher Master Richard Lewis (Go Shin Jutsu Kenpo) and my new teacher (one year) John Bono (Bono JKD/Kajukenbo).   The value of the self-defense training depends on the practice as well as the techniques.  If you train with little body contact, it's hard to learn how both take and deliver.  Since I actually used techniques from this style in the Gathering, I credit my teachers for helping me survive those fights.

Gints

5th the recommendation for the series.   All of the tapes are good, and some of them (Power, Footwork) are totally unique.  The style of the series is to back the training exercises with examples from actual stick fights.   Or, another way of saying that is useful techniques used in the fights are extracted and developed into training drills.   This is what distinguishes these instructional videos from all others, which largely demonstrate techniques developed and trained only under cooperative training in the "dojo."

Gints

Dog Chuck is in the Martinez/Oakland area.

Try Dog Chuck :  cblanch823@comcast.net

If you're interested in sparring, check out my club :

http://home.att.net/~gints/home.htm

There are other teachers in that area, so post if you want more info .

Gints

Most commendable, Junkyard Dog.   You've proven yourself while the rest of us continue to test in the Dojo.  

I would really like to know how the pair caught up with the cycler
and some details on the take down.

That's a lot of fighters.  I hope they wear distinctive clothing so that they are distinguishable from one another.  

Black Shirt vs. Black Shirt
Grey Shirt vs. Grey Shirt

(P.S.  This is a test post as I've beenhaving login troubles)

Excellent.  I really enjoyed the video clips and am looking forward to the full DVD .

Gints

Thanks for posting my message, Marc.

Gruhn,  that SuperKnife blade model is quite handsome.  It's a fine training blade, but in my experience with such a tip on a short knife in sparring matches, the tip is too pointed.  An wielder experienced with that training weapon would control the power, but imagine a full force arc from a #3 angle (more like 4:00pm) to your ribs from someone that doesn't understand the damage this baby can do.  I have a few long (faded!)scars on my left ribs from such a blade and consider myself lucky that my ribs didn't break.  Short training knives offer much more puncture power than longer blades as the wrist is more able to stabilize the torque acting upon it.  The same can be said of thrusting with a stick and comparing the impact from the butt and tip of the stick, using the same angle of attack.

I'll post a picture of my rounded blades (custom crafted by Bob Burgee of Edges2) very soon.  Also, I'll dig up a video clip of an excited knife-newbie stabbing me full force with a Spyderco Endura trainer in a bout of Unarmed vs. Short knife.  Yeee - owww !  I no longer use that blade for sparring, but it is a nice training blade. Even with the round-tipped blades,
the impact is considerable.

Dog Gints

Thanks, Richard.

Perhaps this is easier.  Please check the names for me.  We can post the names as a comment  for the group picture.

http://www.dogbrothers.com/gallery/album19/DBJune2005_6719

Back row:
Dale Frank
Derek Walker
Francisco Taruc
Gints Klimanis
Miguel DeCoste
Hugh Sargent
Richard Estepa
Mamerto "Mo" Estepa
Milt Tinkoff
Chris Schulz
James Stacey (time keeper)
Mark Mikita (drums)

2nd row:
Robert Gage
Glenn Loria
Kris Dunnage
Nick Papadakis
Lester Griffin
Fred Martinez
Ivan Reboli

Front row:
Marc Denny
Eric Knaus
Dennis Hall

Some are missing from the group picture:
Dustin Hinson (on right)
http://www.dogbrothers.com/gallery/album19/DBJune2005_5464

Shannon Mackensie (Red Bandana Man)
http://www.dogbrothers.com/gallery/album19/DBJune2005_5814

Da Strawder (spelling ?)

Sheri Clayton (knife only)

Hi,

Would anyone please help me match some names to fighters, using the pictures from the gallery ?

Thanks,

Gints

1. Single Knife:   Dunno? vs. Chris Schulz
DBJune2005_5357.jpg
also DBJune2005_6279.jpg

2. Single Knife :  Dunno vs. Shannon Mackensie
DBJune2005_5379.jpg

3. Single knife: Derek Walker vs. Dunno?
DBJune2005_5407.jpg

4. Single knife: Dale Frank vs. Dunno?
DBJune2005_5416.jpg

5. Single knife:  Dunno? vs Dunno?
DBJune2005_5464.jpg

6. Single Stick:  Dunno? vs. Rob Gage
DBJune2005_5724.jpg

7. Single Stick: Glenn Loria vs, Dunno?
DBJune2005_5767.jpg

8. Single Stick :  Dunno?  vs. Dunno?
DBJune2005_5981.jpg

Thank you !

There is also Surf Dog's video "Filipino Stick Fighting" available from amazon.com

>I have actually been involved in a real life situation or two and I can say >that things happen really fast and you might not even see the blade until >you realize you have been cut...pretty frightening actually.

TBone,

If you're willing to share your stories, I would love to hear them.  I collect accounts of knife encounters,  though I do not have any of my own.
Your words are valuable, especially the part about not seeing the knife.  I find this to match up with my opinion on knife fighting in that fast hand motions and a small weapon area inhibit the recognition of actual danger.  

When the motions are restricted, such as in constrained sport fencing, the problem is more manageable.  In 2003, I did some knife sparring with some members of a fencing team.  They were definitely
better at thrusting to the face, and I lost many eyes, though it took them a bit to adapt to
circular footwork, slashes, low-line kicks, and attacks to the hand.  One fellow was disturbed that his fencing mask was bashed in by my palm butt,
which ended the match abruptly.  Shucks.

Dog Gints

>1. I see that there are quite a bit of knife on knife match ups. I really >applaud the exploration of this arena. How does a typical fight play out >as far as "scoring" goes? It can be fairly esoteric to spar with a training >blade unless some element of realism is added (I.E. chalk/ink, etc.) or >is it more of an acknowledgement of success from the individual >competitors?

Yes, this is a tough issue.  I think you have to spar often enough to find yourself a place between knife boxing (using Marc's term) and knife waving (what I call persistent circling, "waiting" for an opening while looking cool with flowing knife patterns).  The former seems quite silly, but in the heat of the sparring, this happens all of the time.   The latter is just as silly because you don't spend a lot of time developing the reflexes
for delivering your shots.  

I think that sparring is a training tool for fighting, so one should experiment and push to learn what a body can do.  If you do it often enough, you should know which of your cuts rocked your opponent, and which of his cuts rocked you.

The prevalence of knife boxing
also leads me to believe that a real situation will be the same because,
for some reason, a knife just doesn't completely register as a weapon.
Such is not the case for a stick of respectable length.  Dogs, schooled or not, seem to have a similar reaction.  Perhaps this explains why knife
encounters are so dangerous, besides the fact that knife wounds can be
nasty.

As for chalk/ink, I dunno.  An ink mark will register, but such marking rewards edge over tip touches and trains for those shots that ink the best.  I think that using an aluminum blade with thin garden gloves is more useful.   After taking a few shots on the hand, you'll be avoiding such hits, which would probably lop off a few fingers with a real knife.

Later,

Dog Gints

Tom,

Are you checking out photo 137 (of 174)  in the enlarged version ?
On the unenlarged version, I can't see the spatter, either.  Though,
the spatter is definitely there.  I have the original photos, so it's
easier for me to identify the spatter, which is definitely not marks on the
rolling door wall behind the competitors.  

Cool !

Dog Gints

Ally took a number of photos of that fight, though only a few were posted to the June 2005 Gallery.  

For each of these photos, click once to enlarge the photo.  Click again
for another enlargement and a clearer photo.

In #135 of 174, DBJune2005_6443.jpg, I see what appears to be blood
on the left side of the helmet.

In #137 of 174 DBJune2005_6460.jpg  You can see the blood spurting out of the helmet at this point, after the punch to the face mask (previous picture).

Dog Gints
(thanks for the cool title, Marc !)

Thanks to Ally Yang for the photos.  She never thought she'd end up taking photos of a bunch of guys that think hitting each other with sticks is fun.  Now, she knows that she's supposed to collect "wound" photos.

Anyway, I'd like to comment on downloading the photos.  The first photo that appears is a 640x480 downsized version of Ally's submitted photos.If you want a clearer version, click on the photo again for a roughly 821x547 photo that is much sharper.  Right click on the photo and save.
If the name contains the word "sized", then you have the lower resolution photo.

Gints

Thanks to Marc And Cindy Denny, Eric Knaus, James Stacey, the RAW gym and everyone else involved in this event.

I thoroughly enjoyed smacking sticks with everyone, and this is a one-of-a-kind venue .  Much better than sitting on the sofa, watching a sit-com and eating a bag of Doritos.   I'm glad Marc has continued this event and set it up as a test of individual abilities in an ultimately competitive yet non-tournament format.  There is little that is more satisying than pushing a dude down (or being pushed down), scarring him up, then getting up to shake hands.    During a time period where we spare the rod in favor of drugging the child, I'm glad we can still remember our warrior nature.  Though, those of you that left their mark on me (face and hand bruises) will delight in hearing that my coworkers think I'm weird.

Thanks for an awesome game,

Gints

I also have Vincent Giordano's DVD.   He is doing an excellent job of documenting martial arts from far away places.  The video quality, story and material are excellent.   This video presents the training methods used to produce generations of Indian wrestlers, all without a large budget for equipment.    Fantastic.  This is DVD is unique and a real value.

Here are some photos (taken by Gints Klimanis and Ally Yang) from a recent padded stick & training knife sparring tournament in Campbell, CA :

http://pg.photos.yahoo.com/ph/aygk_martialarts_photos/album?.dir=adcf&.src=ph

The Shinbukan Invitational
Karate, Ju Jitsu & Eskrima
Saturday, March 19, 2005

http://www.shinbukandojo.com/

Enjoy,

Gints

Thanks for the sensible list.  #1 is missing.  Any chance you could repost that section ?

Hello Cindy,

It's good to read about the re-release of the orginal DB series on DVD.
Since I already have the first series on VHS, I would like to know if DVDs are remastered or just VHS transfered to DVD.   If the former, I'll purchase the entire set.  They are some of the best instructional tapes in existence, definitely the best in the stickfighting material.  The old Gathering tape and the first series are "life changer" videos.  

Thanks !

Gints

I watched "Alexander" last weekend.  My take is that this movie is good in the theater but not worth a rental on DVD.  The massive battle scenes were visually stunning, but given the altitude of the fly-overs, the features will probably be reduced to a mass of crawly, zig-zaggy dots on a regular TV.  Most of the battle scenes were a wash of shaky, blurry action interrupted by the occasional, overly graphic spurt of blood.  "Hero" easily exceeds "Alexander" in battle.  Even "House of Flying Daggers" does a better job in small skirmishes.

As a movie about the expansion of an empire, this film was too touchy feely.  It seems as if this movie was designed for the average contemporary audience, offering a taste but not a meal for anyone:  indistinct action for the guys with an equal dose of relationship-wallowing for the gals.   The bisexual theme was repeated excessively throughout the entire movie.  The primary royal fairy displayed breasts rather than pecs, making him nearly indistinguishable from a woman.  If homosexuality is about male-male attraction, why do are all of the "guys"  in "Troy" and "Alexander" look like women ?  At least in "Fight Club", a pretty boy, also Jared Leto, was directly destroyed .

As for the female characters, the initially prominent sexual dimorphism of his East Indian bride was also effectively neutralized.  Each mammary gland (excuse me, breast) was the size of Alexander's head, yet she capably resisted Alexander and eventually held a knife to his throat.  Well, we know who wears the pants.  "Alexander" is just another instantiation of the prime-time wimp husband/boyfriend shows such "Everybody loves Raymond", "Friends", "Married with Children", that Paul Rodriguez show, etc. In yet another gender-equalization scene, the harem was again overpowered by the Alexanders's draw to the royal fairies.

As for other characters,  Angelina Jolie performed wickedly , so, I'd assign her the star role of the movie as she seemed to run the show.  Anthony Hopkins was a detached bumbler with yet another staff of pretty boy scribes.  

"Alexander" is an action movie for the metrosexual.  "There's nothing like spending a day with a good glass of Cab on my marble island in my kitchen."  I'm waiting for "Blade Trinity " .  In the meantime, I suppose I'll have to hold my breath for a car chase or some sort of demolition in a Julia Roberts movie.