Dog Brothers Public Forum
Return To Homepage
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
April 24, 2014, 05:39:43 PM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
Welcome to the Dog Brothers Public Forum.
79266 Posts in 2227 Topics by 1037 Members
Latest Member: DCoutinho
* Home Help Search Login Register
+  Dog Brothers Public Forum
|-+  DBMA Martial Arts Forum
| |-+  Martial Arts Topics
| | |-+  Citizen-Police interactions
« previous next »
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 8 Print
Author Topic: Citizen-Police interactions  (Read 43285 times)
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #150 on: November 05, 2011, 04:12:15 PM »

OWS Protester Arrested At McDonald's
 
Updated: Saturday, 05 Nov 2011, 3:31 PM EDT
Published : Friday, 04 Nov 2011, 9:32 AM EDT
 
MYFOXNY.COM STAFF REPORT
 


MYFOXNY.COM - An Occupy Wall Street protestor was arrested early Friday after a violent rampage at a McDonald's that refused to offer him free food.

The NYPD says it happened at about 2:45 a.m. at a McDonald's near the make-shift tent city in Zuccotti Park.

Fisika Bezabeh, 27, went into the world's largest restaurant chain and demanded free food, apparently craving a burger over the gourmet food being served in the park.

The people behind the counter, who are working instead of protesting, were not about to offer the man free food.

Bezabeh then turned violent, ripped a credit-card reader from a counter and threw it at workers before police arrived and arrested the protester.

There have been growing concerns about security and lawlessness among the protesters.  Earlier this week, a cook at the camp was arrested on sex charges.

And video surfaced Friday morning showing two of the protesters having a fist fight inside of the park.

Mayor Bloomberg noted Thursday that instead of going to the police, the group is simply kicking law-breakers out of the park and allowing them to go free into the city.

Bezabeh was charged with criminal mischief.

Cheryll Forsatz, a McDonald’s spokeswoman, said, “It’s still an ongoing police investigation, and we’re cooperating with the police.”
 


Read more: http://www.myfoxny.com/dpp/news/ows-protester-arrested-at-mcdonalds-20111104-lgf
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #151 on: November 05, 2011, 04:20:51 PM »

http://hotair.com/archives/2011/11/05/good-news-ows-sets-up-women-only-tent-to-help-cut-down-on-rapes/

Good news: OWS sets up women-only tent to help cut down on rapes
 
posted at 4:16 pm on November 5, 2011 by Allahpundit

Grim perfection from Glenn Reynolds: “I guess they really are taking Tahrir Square as their model.”
 
Let it sink in: Their protests now need rape shelters. This is actually happening. And New York City lets it go on.
 

Zuccotti Park has become so overrun by sexual predators attacking women in the night that organizers felt compelled to set up a female-only sleeping tent yesterday to keep the sickos away.
 
The large, metal-framed “safety tent” — which will be guarded by an all-female patrol — can accommodate as many as 18 people and will be used during the day for women-only meetings, said Occupy Wall Street organizers.
 
“This is all about safety in numbers,” said Becky Wartell, 24, a protester from Portland, Maine…
 
Some of the male OWS protesters remained in denial over the growing number of sex attacks.
 
“Sexual harassment gets called rape, and it’s not,” one scoffed when told of the women’s tent.
 
This can’t be repeated enough: With a few exceptions, foremost among them the New York Post, the coverage of OWS protests compared to the coverage of tea-party protests is the worst media double standard in recent history. Nothing compares, because nothing else involves this much distortion on both ends of the coverage. It’s not just that most press outlets (like the protesters themselves) look the other way at depravity happening inside Obamaville, it’s that for years they treated the tea-party movement as some sort of feral mob that was forever on the brink of rampaging through the streets — like, say, Occupy Oakland just did. If you missed it when I posted it last week, go watch the ad the DNC ran in August 2009 when tea partiers first started showing up to town halls on ObamaCare. That set the tone. We began the year with tea-party pols being smeared as killers over a shooting they had nothing to do with and we end it with actual rapes being shrugged off by the press because they’re bad PR for a movement they support. Disgrace.
 
Via the Daily Caller, watch the not-at-all feral or mobbish revolutionary heroes of Occupy D.C. do their thing last night outside AFP. The video doesn’t capture the extent of the menace, either. For that, read R.S. McCain’s interview with D.C. reporter Michelle Fields, who at one point found herself surrounded by a group of men screaming “F*** Michelle Fields.” No wonder she doesn’t want to go back. Tahrir Square indeed.

Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #152 on: November 05, 2011, 07:07:14 PM »

http://www.bostonherald.com/news/regional/view/2011_1105hub_to_occupy_shape_up_or_ship_out/srvc=home&position=2

City officials are vowing to keep the heat on derelict protest-crashers at Occupy Boston, while some demonstrators are calling for drug dealers and lawbreakers to hit the road.
 
“We are looking to get our act together,” said Mike Ippolito, an Occupier who has lived in the makeshift camp since its first day. “Actions are being taken to tighten up. ... I believe weapons, drugs and alcohol have no place here.”
 
Just this week, cops have made two drug busts, including one yesterday in which three men were nabbed for allegedly peddling crack cocaine.

 

Undercover cops probing reports of drug dealing in the tent city busted Atu Austin, 31, of Roxbury and Lamont Daughtery, 21, and Thomas McLaughlin, 29, both of Hyde Park, on charges of selling crack. The alleged drug deal began in the encampment and culminated near the Pine Street Inn homeless shelter, authorities said.
 
“As is evident by our recent drug arrests, we continue to send a very clear message to those individuals that drug distribution will not be tolerated,” Boston police spokeswoman Elaine Driscoll said.
 
In addition to the drug busts, several unruly homeless people have been removed from the site, including one who allegedly menaced Occupiers with a knife. Police are also probing Occupy-related vandalism downtown and expect arrests soon, Driscoll said.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #153 on: November 05, 2011, 09:00:19 PM »


http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2011/11/rampaging-occupiers-attack-78-year-old-woman.php

Rampaging Occupiers Attack 78-Year-Old Woman


We posted video last night in which degenerates from Occupy D.C. stormed the Washington Convention Center where Americans For Prosperity was holding a dinner. In the course of their riot, the Occupiers attacked a 78-year-old woman who had been attending the dinner, and pushed her down a flight of stairs. You see her at around the 3:20 mark of this video, shot by the Daily Caller:





The woman’s name is Dolores Broderson. Small Dead Animals got this email:


Ray Patnaude emails: “My wife and I were at the AFP dinner. Some info on the AFP member who was pushed down the stairs by the protestors… she is the second woman the police are helping up in the Daily Caller video. Her name is Dolores Broderson, age 78. She rode on a bus for 11 hours from Detroit to get there. She went to the emergency room with a bloody nose and bruises on her hand and leg.”

She rode from Detroit for 11 hours because AFP is a genuine grass-roots movement, unlike the Occupiers and their sugar daddies. But that is a relatively minor point. The Occupier movement stands for riot, assault, rape, vandalism, sexual harassment, public urination, public defecation and public masturbation. And Barack Obama owns it lock, stock and barrel. He has endorsed the Occupiers and never uttered a single word to distance himself from them. Their disgusting behavior should be hung around his neck like an anvil when he runs for reelection next year.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #154 on: November 06, 2011, 06:57:37 PM »

**At least there is no gender bias when raping with OWS.

Post reporter spends an in‘tents’ night amid anarchy in Zuccotti Park
By CANDICE M. GIOVE

Last Updated: 12:02 PM, November 6, 2011

Posted: 1:46 AM, November 6, 2011

The cheap walkie-talkie crackles inside a crowded downtown McDonald’s, stopping the gathered mass mid-sip from their Kombucha bottles and cups of corporate coffee.

“There’s a situation,” a vagabond gumshoe dubbed “Conscience” tells me after the static-filled communique arrives over the air at around 3 a.m.

Cornered on the other side of the fast-food joint is Fisika Bezabeh, 27, a Zuccotti squatter who inexplicably returned to the eatery after allegedly clobbering a manager with a credit-card reader earlier in the night.

“We can’t take him in by ourselves,” yells another OWS security-force member.

COPS NETTING COURT JESTERS

B'KLYN TEACHER AMONG DEMONSTRATORS WHO CLASHED WITH COPS OUTSIDE MANHATTAN SUPREME COURT

The Zuccotti “cops” had just spent an hour and a half tracking Bezabeh through goat paths in the park armed with a description from the manager.

“We cannot take him in by ourselves, the cops have to come!” reiterates the OWS security force member.

They call the NYPD -- and it becomes abundantly clear that the cops down there are sick of the antics.

“Every single night it’s the same thing. I mean, some guy was a victim of rape!” an officer snarls. “There comes a time when it’s over. This is a disaster. It’s all we’re doing, every two seconds, is locking somebody up every time. It’s done.

“It’s done,” he repeats. “Occupy Wall Street is no longer a protest.”

Scenes like this -- and far worse -- have been playing out since the Zuccotti Park “occupation” began on Sept. 17.

The parcel is now a sliver of madness, rife with sex attacks, robberies and vigilante justice.

It’s a leaderless bazaar that’s been divided into state-like camps -- with tents packed together so densely that the only way to add more would be to stack them.

And despite an NYPD watchtower overhead and the entire north side of Zuccotti lined with police vehicles, it is quickly becoming one of the most dangerous places in New York City.
I arrive in the Financial District after dark on Thursday lugging a backpack, a sleeping bag and layers upon layers of clothes.

It’s 8 p.m., and the suits and ties fill the bars. They glare at my overstuffed bag as I walk from the E train to a 7-Eleven for a few last-minute items for my night in Zuccotti Park.

The anti-bacterial soap and powder are nearly out. Naturally, the condoms are fully stocked.

Outside, an old-man Occupier in a plaid earflap hat is screaming at people in the crosswalk at Church and Barclay.

“Why are you afraid of bunny rabbits? Whyyyyy?”

As I cautiously walk the Zuccotti perimeter, picking up photocopied literature on anarchy, there is a poster on a tent bearing a set of park rules that includes: “If you want to hook up, go to a singles bar.”

There is literally no space to unfold my sleeping bag. I ask around for help.

Out of nowhere, a man pushing a shopping cart with his friend inside rammed the thing “Jackass”-style into a police barrier and walked off laughing like a hyena.

A woman emerges from a makeshift tent that looks more like a layer cake -- a clear tarp draped over a sleeping bag that is on top of a filthy mattress. It even has a welcome mat missing the “m” and the stench of a vagrant.

“There’s not much space left,” she said and walked off into the darkness.

Every camp tent is like its own state. There is “Camp Anonymous,” the group best known for anti-Scientology protests.

It’s neighbored by a tent full of vampires, the “Class War” tent and the “Occupy Paw Street” tent, whose residents hand out treats to occupying pets.

There’s also “Camp France” and the “Nic at Night” tent, which supplies the protest with smokes.

I settle on a sliver near Broadway by an OWS library -- which frighteningly has a children’s section. On a bulletin board, there are personal messages like, “Call your sister!”

I’m wedged between a newbie from Brooklyn and some guy from Toronto, who preferred the experience of urban camping to his buddy’s couch or a hotel.

“My knees will crush you,” a hulking squatter shouts. “I don’t want to hurt you.

“You’re in my doorway. I’m going to crush you.”

Someone takes offense and yells, “Manners!”

He’s much kinder when he emerges later from his green tent and hands me a shiny Mylar blanket for extra warmth. “It’s going to get cold,” he said.

This spirit of generosity and the naivete of the original OWS protesters is devolving into a state of distrust and paranoia, however.

They speak of theft, about government infiltrators and tales of Rikers Island castoffs being dropped off to roam and ravage the site.

From underneath my blanket, I hear allegations of financial corruption and intimidation over sexual orientation.

“I’m in a tent that keeps getting flooded, ransacked and robbed,” fumes a transgender group leader -- a female who identifies as a male.

He said that the transgender group would create its own police force for transgender protesters and females, since an immense distrust loomed over the OWS-created authority.

That group is also demanding financial transparency amid growing concern over the use of the $750,000 war chest.

They have a point. I notice supply-station cupboards are dangerously lacking any blankets, tents, tarps or Mylar.

“Someone forgot to get that stuff out of storage,” an attendant claimed.

“We have three-quarters of a million dollars in the bank and all these f--king people are not doing financial accounting while we’re calling for it from the larger corporations,” says the transgender leader. “A lot of good people are quitting.”

A day later, a female-only “safety tent” would be erected to shield women from predators.

Organizers plan to add a medical tent, as well as others designed to provide safe sleeping for gay, transgender and co-ed groups.

The threat of rape is very real here -- for women and men.

Sitting in the McDonald’s just moments after Bezabeh was hauled off in cuffs, Lauren DiGioia, 26, tells me about how she became one of the growing number of victims on her very first night in the park.

“I was forced into a very tight space,” she says. “He kind of moved up against me.

“ ‘Oh, let me warm you up. It’s cold out here,’ ” the creep told her, she said. “He kept pursuing me, and he started becoming aroused, and I could tell that he was becoming aroused,” she said. “I just tried to shield myself.”

He allegedly groped her, pulled her and tried to get on top of her.

“I kept thinking to myself, ‘In the morning, I am going to get this guy arrested,’ but in the morning, he was gone,” she said.

DiGioia, who is from Clifton, NJ, was shocked to see her alleged attacker’s image in The Post about a week later -- and she identified him to the police.

She is now offering counsel to other victims, as new ones crop up every day.

“I just talked to two gentlemen who were raped last night, and they don’t want to press charges because [authorities] wanted to take them in an ambulance and . . . do a rape kit,” she said.

She passed on their account to the security force, while encouraging them to press charges.

“There was another girl raped by the same man,” she said from a table in the McDonald’s, which has become the headquarters of the revolution.

It’s a place to meet, to get warm, to scarf down dollar-menu grub and to use the bathroom that becomes increasingly vile as the night goes on.

I’m ultimately invited to spend the night in a Camp Anonymous tent instead of solo in a sleeping bag.

I spend the rest of the night awake against the wall of a tent built for four -- but packed with six.

My bunkmates include an anarchist, a sexual-assault victim, two security-force members, a girl dressed like the devil and her kitten -- the “Anarkitty.”

“We are a microcosm of all of society’s defects and the failing economy,” DiGioia said. “Just because we’re here under a microscope, everybody’s going to come and throw up their arms and say we have to shut this place down.”

cgiove@nypost.com



Read more: http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/my_in_tents_night_amid_anarchy_of_ush5s5NscUZincUN0tF0yO
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #155 on: November 11, 2011, 06:20:22 PM »

http://www.abc17news.com/news.php?id=3699

How to end a foot pursuit.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #156 on: November 11, 2011, 06:45:32 PM »

**Crafty wanted this story told.

One gun, no hands: the Marcus Young incident

by Massad Ayoob

 Situation: The criminal emptied a .38 into you, leaving your gun arm paralyzed and your other hand torn apart--and now, he's reaching for a machine gun.

 Lesson: Never give up. Be resourceful. Focus on neutralizing the threat and worry about how badly hurt you are after it's over.

 March 7, 2003. Sgt. Marcus Young is midway through an evening shift, working patrol for the Ukiah, California Police Department. He's a Navy vet, second-degree black belt in Shorinryu karate, 18 years on the force. With him is a 17-year-old police cadet named Julian Covella. Young likes the kid. A devoted husband and father, the 40-year-old sergeant serves as president of a local school board. His own young son is thinking about going the police cadet route and Marcus is particularly interested in how it's working out for Julian. Then comes the seemingly routine call: a shoplifter at the Wal-Mart Superstore. Young wheels the patrol car in that direction.

 In the next few minutes, he and his young cadet ride-along will save each other's lives.

 The Incident

 2148 hours, 9:48 PM.

 As the cadet watches, Sgt. Young takes custody of the wan-looking suspect. Monica Winnie is only 18, but she could pass for 10 or 15 years older. Wal-Mart security guard Brett Schott watches as Young politely escorts her to the patrol car and puts her into the back seat.

 Now comes a medium-sized man who moves rapidly and purposefully toward them through the darkened parking lot, his hands ominously thrust into his jacket pockets. He wears the face of Satan and it's not a trick of the light.



 Neal Beckman, Winnie's companion, is a 35-year-old Caucasian with a long, bad history. He is a member of a gang called the Nazi Low Riders and is wanted in connection with a $100,000 home invasion robbery. He has carefully cultivated the Satanic image, his sculpted mustache and goatee set off by small devil horns tattooed on his forehead. Unseen by the cop is his full backpack tattoo of the devil himself. In his pockets, also unseen by Young, are a fixed-blade hunting knife in his left hand and a late Smith & Wesson Model 637 stainless Airweight in his right, all five chambers loaded.

 Beckman has made it to close range when Young says in command voice, "Take your hands out of your pockets." There is no response. Young repeats the command and Beckman answers, "I have a knife."

 The blade comes out, held as if its wielder means business. Young reacts instantly in accordance with his training as both policeman and martial artist. He grabs the knife-hand and pivots off mid-line, wrenching the suspect's arm into the double-ninety-degree configuration known in California police circles as a twist-lock. He can feel something snapping and popping in the arm, but the knife-wielder does not let go. Both of them slam into the side of the car.

 And suddenly, there is a bright flash and a searing heat and Sgt. Marcus Young realizes he has just been shot in the face at close range.

 Near-Fatal Flurry

 In the swirl of movement that follows, things happen fast even though it seems to the cop as if everything has gone into slow motion. More bullets hammer into him. The burning sensations tear through his right arm and his back, and something smashes into his left side as if he has been struck in the rib cage with an aluminum baseball bat. Through it all, the sergeant is aware of the young woman screaming wordlessly in the back seat of the patrol unit.

 Brett Schott, the unarmed security guard, leaps into the fight. He barrels into Beckman, grabs the revolver and wrenches it away. He does not realize he is holding an empty gun. Beckman has fired all five shots and four of them have struck the cop.

 The man with the face that mimics Satan shifts the hunting knife from his left hand to his right and sinks it viciously into the side of the security guard. The blade plunges deep into the left side of the guard's chest, almost immediately collapsing the lung and opening a wound so big that lung tissue is visible. He levers the blade and tears the wound wider, completely severing the deltoid muscle.

 Schott disengages, instantly weakened by the massive wound, realizing he is hemorrhaging massively and perhaps fatally. He tries to make his way to another car for cover.

 Meanwhile, Young has regained his feet and reached for his own gun. Yet it does not rise into line of sight in the movement he has practiced so many times. He tries again and realizes his right arm is not responding to his mental command. The humerus has been shattered and there is nerve damage. His gun arm is paralyzed.

 The Ukiah PD firearms instructors are thorough. They have taught Young how to draw weak-handed if his gun arm is taken out. He makes the attempt but his left hand isn't working right, either. Glancing down, he sees that it has been ripped open, literally torn apart, its separated ten dons visible through the opened skin.

 And now, the suspect is on his feet, tearing open the right front door of the patrol car and closing it behind him as he jumps in. He's not trying to drive away. Instead, he drops down on the seat on his left side as he claws for the switch he knows is hidden there somewhere. The switch that will release into his murderous hands a fresh weapon and a deadlier one.

 Ukiah PD keeps two loaded long guns in each patrol car. One is a Remington 870 pump shotgun, loaded with 12 gauge 00 buckshot. The other, secured to the ceiling of the front seat, is an HK33. It's not just a .223 autoloading rifle. It has a selector switch. The man who has just attempted to murder two uniformed officials is about to access a true assault rifle, literally a machine gun, and the price of poker has just gone up.

 Where There's A Will ...

 Through it all, the young cadet, Julian Covella, has stood nearby, torn between obedience and his own strong sense of duty. Police cadets are told that under no circumstances are they to join in fights involving sworn officers, and this training has held him in check, yet every fiber of his being has been telling him, do something!

 Now, his chance comes.

 As Beckman tries furiously to free the heavy weapons and turn them on his victims, Young turns to the boy and says, "Take my gun out and put it in my hand." Julian fumbles, but only for a moment, releasing the thumb-break safety strap of the Level One duty holster. He carefully withdraws the pistol, a Beretta 96G, and places it into the bloody left hand that the wounded lawman extends to him.

 It's the "G" model, decocker only, no safety to disengage. Young will later thank God his firearms instructors drilled him intensively in weak hand only shooting. Kneeling to steady himself, he raises the gun to eye level, not trying for a sight picture, just visually superimposing the gun over where he knows he has to shoot. The center mass of his antagonist's body is shielded by the car door, but Young has been told that .40 caliber service pistol bullets can punch through auto bodies, so he fires. The first shot goes double action and he sees it strike where he aimed it. No reaction. The gun has cocked itself and he squeezes off a second shot single action. Again, the bullet goes where aimed, and again, the jacketed hollow point .40 bullet fails to make it through the door.

 Time for Plan B. He raises the pistol higher. Startled by the first return fire, the man who tried to kill him turns and looks at the officer, and he is staring down the gun barrel when the first shot smashes through the closed window of the car and into his face. He jerks and moves violently, Young fires a fourth time and now the attacker goes limp and still.

 Young keeps him covered for what seems to him a very long time before he realizes it's over. He knows he has been shot multiple times, in the torso and the head and doesn't know how long he will remain conscious. He can see the guard is down, bleeding profusely. Only young Julian remains able-bodied on the side of the good guys.

 Knowing both his hands are badly disabled and the cocked gun is covered with blood, Young decides not to try to decock his privately owned, department approved Beretta. He doesn't want to hold a cocked pistol in an injured hand, or drop one if he passes out, so he sets it gently on the ground where he can keep an eye on it.

 He tells Julian to get on the radio and call in. Then, remembering what he had learned in classes he had taken from Col. Dave Grossman, Young begins deliberate controlled breathing exercises to keep calm, conscious and alive.

 Aftermath And Lessons

 Emergency Medical Service response was swift, but the receiving hospital was only equipped to perform emergency surgery on one patient at a time. The heroic guard who had jumped into the fight unarmed to save the embattled officer was near death and went onto the table first. He had lost about half of his blood and it took three hours for the surgeons to stabilize him and save his life.

 During that time, Sgt. Young waited without pain-killer, because he had lost two pints of blood and his blood pressure was low; doctors didn't dare give him depressants. The pain didn't really hit him until 45 to 60 minutes after the shooting.

 The first .38 Special slug had struck Young in the left cheek and exited the back of his neck, fortunately missing the brain. He had never lost consciousness. He does not remember the exact sequence of the following hits, but one had smashed the right arm. Another had gone past his armor and punched into his back, causing serious injuries which, like the right arm wound, have required multiple surgeries since and will probably need more. The blow to his right side had been a bullet stopping in his Point Blank Level III-A bullet-resistant vest. It left a massive bruise, but caused no serious damage. Doctors said this projectile, had it not been stopped by the Kevlar, would have killed the policeman. They determined that he had not been shot in the left hand, but it had been so badly mangled during the fight it took hours of surgery to repair the tendon damage.

 The would-be cop-killer was DOA. Young's third shot had caught him square in the forehead. Because Beckman was down on the seat with the head back the ogive of the bullet had caused it to skid off the skull beneath the scalp, emerging at the crown with a big, ugly exit wound, but inflicting no life-threatening damage. As he convulsed and twisted to get away from the return fire, he had presented his buttocks toward the policeman. Young's final shot, the officer's visibility impaired by the broken glass of the door window, had struck Beckman there and ranged up deep inside him, piercing the liver and lodging in his neck. This had been the fatal shot.



 Both men had been shot in the face and head and actually sustained fairly minor wounds. The "fatal" hits--potentially on the good guy, decisively on the bad--had struck each in the trunk of the body.

 On that fateful night, the sergeant had not been wearing a backup gun. He realizes now a second weapon carried in a manner readily accessible to the non-dominant hand might have allowed him to neutralize his lethal attacker more swiftly.

 Young wore his concealed body armor religiously and it saved his life. Some 700 of us watched as Young was inducted into the Kevlar Survivors' Club in January '04, at the American Society for Law Enforcement Training annual conference in St. Louis. He joined more than 2,500 brother and sister officers who owe their lives to that technology. Young was officially pronounced Save Number 2,751.

 He credits the training he received from his department and from outside resources, ranging from Col. Grossman to his various sensei in the martial arts, for his ability to endure incredible punishment and be able to think creatively and respond when the terrifying curve ball of seeming helplessness in the face of death came at him. The ability to stay calm and keep thinking served him well. At the same ASLET conference, giving a talk on the FBI/Miami shooting in 1986, Dr. French Anderson made a telling statement which applied directly to Young's incident: "If you can think and if you can move, you can still fight."

 Be Prepared

 The order Sgt. Young gave to the man who was planning to murder him--"Take your hands out of your pockets"--was intuitive for any cop in the same situation, yet it resulted in what the medical community euphemistically calls "a negative outcome." I suspect the next time Young confronts a hostile man with hands concealed, he will take him at gunpoint and specifically order him to let go of anything in his pockets, and then very slowly withdraw his empty right hand and then his empty left hand. The weapons Neal Beckman held in each of his hands each almost ended the life of a protector of the public on the night of March 7, 2003 in that dimly-lit Wal-Mart parking lot.

More departments are carrying their long guns up front these days where they belong and more are using patrol rifles, even select-fire .223s as issued by Ukiah PD. This is all to the good. Care must be taken, however, not to cut corners and to make sure each such weapon is secured in such a manner it's readily accessible to authorized personnel, but relatively inaccessible to perpetrators such as Beckman. Fortunately, Ukiah PD kept its long guns securely locked in overhead racks, the means of instant release known to the officers but not immediately apparent to an invader in the patrol car. The potential of a machine gun in the hands of someone like Beckman does not require much imagination.

 Be prepared to deal with distorted perceptions during the fight and other phenomena later. With one of the nation's leading experts on "post shooting trauma," psychologist Alexis Artwohl, at his side, Young told ASLET attendees of what he had experienced. Things went into slow motion early. At times he fought "on auto pilot." He experienced some memory loss, such as the sequence of the wounds he sustained subsequent to the first.

 Interestingly, it was the third time in his career a criminal had put a gun to his head. From the time of those incidents through March 2003, he had suffered occasional nightmares in which he relived the incidents, or in which he fired his gun and it didn't work.

 Since the night in question, when he survived a gunshot wound to the head and then killed his attacker with a perfectly functioning Beretta, those nightmares have stopped.

 Epilog

 In the vehicle occupied earlier by the shoplifting suspect and the would-be cop-killer were several pipe bombs. Case investigators suspect the suspects had planned to use the explosives in a robbery. She pled guilty to misdemeanor theft, possession of explosives and grand theft, the latter on a subsequently discovered outstanding warrant.



 The heroic security guard Brett Schatt, and the courageous young police cadet Julian Covella, received numerous awards for valor. These included heroism citations from the Veterans of Foreign Wars and the American Legion, and dual Citizen of the Year awards from the California Narcotics Officers' Association. Covella has since been accepted as a cadet at the United States Naval Academy at Annapolis.

 Sgt. Young, now 41, is on light duty at the department, still recovering from his severe physical injuries and facing more surgery. A NRA member, he was awarded the National Rifle Association's honors as Police Officer of the Year for 2003, and the Mayor's Medal of Valor. He has also been nominated for the Presidential Medal of Valor and that of the California Attorney General's Office. Marcus Young's incident will be included in the curriculum of a new course from the California Police Standards and Training council devoted to the management of fear and anger in crisis.

 Young himself feels he owes his survival not only to Julian and Brett, but to the many instructors who trained him over the years. "They taught me to shoot from awkward positions if I was wounded," he says, "and they taught me to be resourceful and keep thinking and keep fighting no matter how I might be injured. They taught me to never give up. And I want to thank them publicly for that."

 There have been death threats against Marcus Young. He is concerned. But he is not afraid.

Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #157 on: November 13, 2011, 04:51:43 PM »



Police say 2 officers cut by Occupy SF protesters
 



Saturday, November 12, 2011


(11-12) 22:07 PST San Francisco (AP) --
 
Police say Occupy San Francisco protesters attacked two officers in separate incidents during a march.
 
Police spokesman Carlos Manfredi tells the Los Angeles Times officers were trying to keep marchers out of the middle of an intersection where trains were running when a woman came out of the crowd, slashed an officer's hand with a pen knife or razor blade, then disappeared back into the crowd before he realized he'd been cut.
 
Later at the same location, police say a man came out of the crowd and grabbed an officer's radio, and when the officer chased him another protester pushed the officer, cut his face and tore his uniform.
 
Police could not find the attackers and no one has been arrested.
 
Both officers were treated at the scene and released.


Read more: http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/n/a/2011/11/12/national/a220734S06.DTL
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #158 on: December 04, 2011, 07:04:11 PM »



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hhPdH3wE0_Y&feature=share
Logged
JDN
Power User
***
Posts: 2004


« Reply #159 on: December 05, 2011, 09:36:08 AM »

What is left out of the tape is that a DIRECT ORDER was given to the campus police to do it peacefully.  The campus police disobeyed.  Therefore the perpetrator and the chief of police have been suspended (with full pay) for disobeying an order and may be fired.  Discipline and following orders IS important.

"We told the police to remove the tents or the equipment," she (their boss - the Chancellor) told the paper. "We told them very specifically to do it peacefully, and if there were too many of them, not to do it, if the students were aggressive, not to do it."  That seems very clear; if you meet resistance, you back off, you do not escalate.
Logged
DougMacG
Power User
***
Posts: 5541


« Reply #160 on: December 05, 2011, 11:41:36 AM »

Question for GM or others with law enforcement familiarity:

I am seeing police reports (in Minneapolis) that come just from officers performing a lookup on license plates.  It occurs to me that it is an automated process where they shoot a picture of the plate and the computer checks it for warrants, expired plates, current license, good or bad driving record etc. These are on the fly situations without any indication of any other lawbreaking.  Do you know if that is so?

Example: Received in my email today from police regarding a former tenant still claiming to live at our address:

"While doing directed patrol in the xth Pct, I observed listed vehicle, license xxxxx, being operated in the above area.  I did a routine check on the license plate, and this showed the registered owner was shown to have a suspended Mn driver's license.  Arrested Party: xxxx xxxxxx - 27/ Address: xxx xxxxx.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #161 on: December 05, 2011, 12:23:16 PM »

Doug,

It's commonplace for patrol officers to run plates looking for "hits" while on patrol. It's a good way to snag warrants/stolen vehicles and other things. Sometimes you find a stolen plate on a vehicle, which tends to lead to other interesting things.
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #162 on: December 11, 2011, 03:58:56 PM »

Comments by a USMS service friend:
============

No shortage of dynamics in this story.

It must really be shocking to learn that all the defensive tactics you learned in the academy simply didn't do you one bit of good against a street thug who apparently was not at all impressed with, or affected by, said defensive tactics training.

--------------------

Takoma Park officer fatally shoots suspect
By Matt Schudel
 
A suspect in a carjacking attempt in Takoma Park was fatally shot by police Saturday as he struggled with an officer after a chase, authorities said.  Takoma Park police said the incident began about 3:50 p.m. with an attempt to take a car at a gas station in the 6700 block of New Hampshire Avenue.  Police said a man drove to the station and tried to take a Porsche from its owner. The owner resisted and was stabbed with what appeared to be a steak knife, police said.
 
The Porsche owner was taken to a hospital in critical condition.
 
A suspect was pursued by police to Metzerott and Riggs roads in Prince George’s County. On the way, police said, the suspect’s car struck three occupied vehicles. At Metzerott and Riggs, the suspect’s car flipped over, and he began to run.
A Takoma Park officer followed him and tried to subdue him with a Taser. They struggled, and he beat her as she lay on the ground , police said.
 
Police said a second Takoma Park officer arrived and fatally shot the suspect. Names were not available.
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #163 on: December 11, 2011, 06:09:09 PM »

second post:

By PoliceOne Staff
LAFAYETTE, Ind. — Newly-released video shows a suspect lunge at a police officer moments before responding officers shot him after slashing a fellow cop’s face with a knife.
Arson suspect Paul Spencer, 39, was pursued by Officer Jeff Webb for almost four miles in October, according to WLFI. Spencer's car left the roadway and Webb pulled up behind him, along with assisting officers Ron Dombkowski and Joe Fisher.
In the video, Spencer lunges out of his car at Dombkowski. Moments later, Spencer stabbed Dombkowski in the face using a large knife, according to Lafayette Police Chief Don Roush.

About 22 feet stood between Spencer and Dombkowski, a 13-year veteran of the department. Autopsy results determined that police shot Spencer seven times after the knife attack.
People in the neighborhood commented on the incident, which could be heard from nearby homes.
"I heard five to six rapid fire rounds, clearly gun shots, and I was like...that's not good. That's what I woke up to this morning," local resident John Blichmann said.

Spencer died at the hospital a few hours later, and Dombkowski was admitted for treatment.
Officers began their pursuit after receiving a call about a vehicle that matched one connected to a duplex set on fire.

Per departmental policy, all three officers were placed on paid administrative leave following the shooting
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #164 on: December 25, 2011, 02:46:09 PM »

John Brumbaugh, whom I happen to know from Machado JJ many years ago, posted the following on his FB page:

http://www.dailybreeze.com/ci_19614472?IADID=Search-www.dailybreeze.com-www.dailybreeze.com
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #165 on: December 27, 2011, 04:41:30 PM »

http://www.ktla.com/news/landing/ktla-deputy-murrieta-bar-shooting,0,4182153.story
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #166 on: December 27, 2011, 04:45:20 PM »

http://www.wbaltv.com/r/23810790/detail.html
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #167 on: December 27, 2011, 04:52:00 PM »

http://downeybeat.com/2011/10/for-second-time-this-month-downey-officers-fatally-shoot-suspect-10697/
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #168 on: December 27, 2011, 05:02:06 PM »


Lessons to be learned:

1.Don't run from the police.

2. If you are stupid enough to run from the police, don't make a furtive movement that indicates you are drawing a weapon.

3. Don't bring a stick and a knife to a gunfight.

Logged
JDN
Power User
***
Posts: 2004


« Reply #169 on: December 27, 2011, 05:07:43 PM »

I think those are all good lessons, but in this instance he didn't even have a weapon according to the article.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #170 on: December 27, 2011, 05:09:29 PM »

Maybe the police could consider not shooting some of these people.

Also, let me get this out of the way.  I am not a cop.
I am a paramedic.
I have been with lone cops and fought alongside them till their backup showed.
I have been in situations where we did the fighting till the police showed (not the plan, I assure you)
I know the job is dangerous and stressful.
I have witnessed extremely sketchy behavior from some officers.

Just some part of who I am.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #171 on: December 27, 2011, 05:09:47 PM »

I think those are all good lessons, but in this instance he didn't even have a weapon according to the article.

If the officer reasonably believed that he was drawing a weapon at that moment, it's a legal shoot.

Graham v. Connor

Reasonable officer's perception.

Stupid should hurt, sometimes it's fatal.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #172 on: December 27, 2011, 05:13:22 PM »

Maybe the police could consider not shooting some of these people.

Also, let me get this out of the way.  I am not a cop.
I am a paramedic.
I have been with lone cops and fought alongside them till their backup showed.
I have been in situations where we did the fighting till the police showed (not the plan, I assure you)
I know the job is dangerous and stressful.
I have witnessed extremely sketchy behavior from some officers.

Just some part of who I am.

And there are some officers that are sketchy, just like there are EMTs/Paramedics that "lose" narcs on runs and have all the cash and valuables "disappear" on the patients they transport to the ER.

I don't think either is but a small minority of those that do the jobs in question.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #173 on: December 27, 2011, 05:16:21 PM »

http://abclocal.go.com/kfsn/story?section=news/local&id=8163016

Don't know the law about cell phones so I don't know if the police are allowed to snatch them.  I think they should not be if they are.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #174 on: December 27, 2011, 05:18:57 PM »

And there are some officers that are sketchy, just like there are EMTs/Paramedics that "lose" narcs on runs and have all the cash and valuables "disappear" on the patients they transport to the ER.

I don't think either is but a small minority of those that do the jobs in question.


I put that out there lest you think I am just a cop basher with a criminal record who has never taken a risk in the street in order to do his job, not to say that my profession has nothing but clean people.  In fact, you can go ahead and post a million links regard medic misconduct and I will probably not defend them.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #175 on: December 27, 2011, 05:20:37 PM »

So then what's your point?

Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #176 on: December 27, 2011, 05:29:18 PM »

My point was in what I said.  To provide some background so anyone that decides to answer does not think I am randomly bashing cops.  I do have questions about how many violent encounters are handled and so I bring them up.

Let me ask you a different question, what do you consider the role of the police to be?  I know what I think, but it is likely different from what you think.  I am not trying to be combative, here.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #177 on: December 27, 2011, 05:32:56 PM »

To enforce the law, to act as a "community caretaker", to work with other agencies to protect the public at large.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #178 on: December 27, 2011, 05:34:39 PM »

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/28112637/ns/us_news-crime_and_courts/t/nyc-police-officers-charged-sodomy-attack/#.TvpVNPL7aSo
(I know they were acquitted but something happened)

And I am sure that no one has forgotten Abner Louima.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #179 on: December 27, 2011, 05:39:25 PM »

Sounds fairly close to what I have always thought.  Then, how have we arrived at a place where we often have hostile relationships between the police and citizens?  I can completely understand why it goes poorly when you are being arrested.
Do you think there is an us against them mentality?
What advice would you give to people with clean records that feel like they are being profiled.  Not just a simple traffic stop, but a better dose, complete with cuffs?
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #180 on: December 27, 2011, 05:39:43 PM »

Again, what's your point? Want me to post all the EMS popped from stealing and groping patients? Just google "EMT arrested".
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #181 on: December 27, 2011, 05:44:59 PM »

I suppose you can if you like.  There are a lot of links up regarding people doing bad things and getting jammed.  I added some links, too.

Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #182 on: December 27, 2011, 05:51:58 PM »

Sounds fairly close to what I have always thought.  Then, how have we arrived at a place where we often have hostile relationships between the police and citizens? 

**Most law abiding citizens have a positive relationship with police.

I can completely understand why it goes poorly when you are being arrested.
Do you think there is an us against them mentality?

**Sure, and the typical cop bashing poster here is a perfect example of why there is such a thing. The public at large is all for the law being enforced, except when it's their kid getting arrested, or them getting stopped for speeding, then things get hypocritical sometimes. Also, despite the endless stream of police shows/movies, very few capture the reality of the job. Thus the public often thinks they understand how things work, which is usually based on a screenwriter's imagination and has very little to do with reality.

What advice would you give to people with clean records that feel like they are being profiled.  Not just a simple traffic stop, but a better dose, complete with cuffs?

**If you believe that you have been mistreated by a LEO, you can file a complaint with his/her agency. You can file a civil rights complaint with the Dept. of Justice, you can seek out attorneys for civil litigation at both the state and federal levels (The are law firms that specialize in just suing law enforcement agencies).
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #183 on: December 27, 2011, 05:55:11 PM »

Additionally, I will say that a good part of my concern with police power is that, in a worst case scenario, 2 problems arise:

1. Police officers are people, just like all of us.
2. They are a group of people that I cannot defend myself against, if I were ever to feel that I needed to.

And believe me, I do my level best to avoid those things.  I don't speed.  Got the necessary stickers, am polite when stopped and avoid parts of town where they might not want to see me.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #184 on: December 27, 2011, 05:59:32 PM »

Additionally, I will say that a good part of my concern with police power is that, in a worst case scenario, 2 problems arise:

1. Police officers are people, just like all of us.
2. They are a group of people that I cannot defend myself against, if I were ever to feel that I needed to.

And believe me, I do my level best to avoid those things.  I don't speed.  Got the necessary stickers, am polite when stopped and avoid parts of town where they might not want to see me.

Ok, so your solution is?
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #185 on: December 27, 2011, 06:03:20 PM »


**Most law abiding citizens have a positive relationship with police.

Not a LEO, but from my perspective, there is a lot of fear in that, because you can't manage an unpleasant conversation the way you would with someone else.


**Sure, and the typical cop bashing poster here is a perfect example of why there is such a thing. The public at large is all for the law being enforced, except when it's their kid getting arrested, or them getting stopped for speeding, then things get hypocritical sometimes. Also, despite the endless stream of police shows/movies, very few capture the reality of the job. Thus the public often thinks they understand how things work, which is usually based on a screenwriter's imagination and has very little to do with reality.


Do you think police should strive to be better than other people?  I have a few friends that are former Marines and a common theme is that the standard for them is supposedly higher than the standard that the average man deals with.  Is it like that for police?  Are they taught to not buy into the idea that they are part of society not us against them?  Heck, is that even a legitimate question?  Are police part of society at large?  Just guys and gals with a job to do?

Are you a cop?  It might not even be appropriate to get into this with you if you are not.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #186 on: December 27, 2011, 06:12:31 PM »

Solution?  That has to come from law enforcement.  I have no power, so in general life, I just avoid as much as possible.  The police have an incredible amount of power.  The police face an incredible amount of danger.  Nothing in my life mirrors that.  I will say that the job is voluntary, though and some of the hostility that comes out during the occasional traffic stop or random encounter goes a long way towards bad relationships.
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #187 on: December 27, 2011, 06:20:23 PM »

Do you think police should strive to be better than other people?  

**There are extensive writings on the topic of law enforcement ethics. In a nutshell, yes, the LEO is and should be held to a higher standard than the public at large.

I have a few friends that are former Marines and a common theme is that the standard for them is supposedly higher than the standard that the average man deals with.  Is it like that for police?  

**Yes.

Are they taught to not buy into the idea that they are part of society not us against them?  

**Yes. Especially today, there is an extensive amount of training in the pre-service academy as well as in-service training on ethics, community partnerships and communications skills, sometime to the detriment of other skillsets.

Heck, is that even a legitimate question?  Are police part of society at large?  Just guys and gals with a job to do?

**Sure. Just like any group that lives outside the mainstream, they tend to flock together. Just like Nurses, Firefighters, EMS and others tend to do. Can you sit down with a group of people that live normal 9-5 jobs and tell them about the junkie who was flatlining until you hit him with narcan, then he tried to kill you for it? Or tell them about the SIDS call you went to, or the single vehicle rollover with multiple fatals?
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #188 on: December 27, 2011, 06:22:20 PM »

Solution?  That has to come from law enforcement.  I have no power, so in general life, I just avoid as much as possible.  The police have an incredible amount of power.  The police face an incredible amount of danger.  Nothing in my life mirrors that.  I will say that the job is voluntary, though and some of the hostility that comes out during the occasional traffic stop or random encounter goes a long way towards bad relationships.

In the US, the public shapes how law enforcement does it's job.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #189 on: December 27, 2011, 06:32:23 PM »

**Sure. Just like any group that lives outside the mainstream, they tend to flock together. Just like Nurses, Firefighters, EMS and others tend to do. Can you sit down with a group of people that live normal 9-5 jobs and tell them about the junkie who was flatlining until you hit him with narcan, then he tried to kill you for it? Or tell them about the SIDS call you went to, or the single vehicle rollover with multiple fatals?

Of course not. 

In the US, the public shapes how law enforcement does it's job.

I live in Tx so maybe it is different here.  Many things happen by policy.  Sometimes, the public can get them shot down, if you have some vulnerable politicians.  Sometimes the policies are not widely publicized and until someone with juice is irritated, nothing happens.  Again, I live here so it may be different. (of course the government can negatively affect cops and that is not handled unless there are some vulnerable politicians)



Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #190 on: December 27, 2011, 07:02:18 PM »

Police chiefs are appointed by elected mayors, County Sheriffs are directly elected by the public. State level LE answers to the Gov./state legislature. Texas cops tend to have a different culture than California cops, or cops from the Northeast. Why? The reflect the populations and laws of those places.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #191 on: December 27, 2011, 07:29:08 PM »

My interest is sparked and I have emailed the PR office about how the police chief is hired.  Austin is a place with a powerful city manager and that person is not elected.  Sheriffs tend to be more responsive to the people (around here) because they answer directly to the electorate.  You can see this in the differences in how the deputies in neighboring counties act.  I will know more about the police chief soon enough.
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #192 on: December 27, 2011, 08:13:11 PM »

"  , , ,My point was in what I said.  To provide some background so anyone that decides to answer does not think I am randomly bashing cops."

Well, I got this point.  I think it is tres cool that you have stood side by side with LEOs in moments of trouble.  My respect and appreciation.  I'm sure if he were to pause a moment it would occur to GM to say the same , , , grin
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #193 on: December 27, 2011, 08:26:16 PM »

"  , , ,My point was in what I said.  To provide some background so anyone that decides to answer does not think I am randomly bashing cops."

Well, I got this point.  I think it is tres cool that you have stood side by side with LEOs in moments of trouble.  My respect and appreciation.  I'm sure if he were to pause a moment it would occur to GM to say the same , , , grin

Well, where I'm from, Police/Fire/EMS always is expected to be looking out for the others in the "Emergency Services" field. That does not mean overlooking ethical violations.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #194 on: December 27, 2011, 10:33:44 PM »

These conversations are hard.  I really am trying to talk about this without starting a fight.  I also wanted to express that I have supported the police with the only thing I truly own, which is my body.  But, by the same token, I do want to express the distrust I feel when I am not in uniform.  When I am not in uniform, I make it a point to not mention anything because it changes the encounter and I want to be treated like everyone else.  That sometimes makes me unhappy.  My hope is that some LEOs will see that even someone that is almost totally on their side still has a great deal of heartburn over what they see happening between the police and citizens.  Dunno if I have done a good job, but I have made my feelings known.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #195 on: December 27, 2011, 10:38:40 PM »

And Guro Marc, I will call you Guro since others do and I am new to all this, thanks for the kind words and helping me feel like I am not crazy!
Logged
G M
Power User
***
Posts: 11506


« Reply #196 on: December 27, 2011, 10:46:21 PM »

These conversations are hard.  I really am trying to talk about this without starting a fight.  I also wanted to express that I have supported the police with the only thing I truly own, which is my body.  But, by the same token, I do want to express the distrust I feel when I am not in uniform.  When I am not in uniform, I make it a point to not mention anything because it changes the encounter and I want to be treated like everyone else.  That sometimes makes me unhappy.  My hope is that some LEOs will see that even someone that is almost totally on their side still has a great deal of heartburn over what they see happening between the police and citizens.  Dunno if I have done a good job, but I have made my feelings known.

Ah, so you demonstrate not wanting to start a fight by posting the articles you did to start things off?  rolleyes
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #197 on: December 27, 2011, 11:07:58 PM »

Don't want to fight but don't want to fake my position either.

In fairness, you posted a few links, as well.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #198 on: December 27, 2011, 11:08:41 PM »

And I have tried to be very polite.  I hope I have succeeded.
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 29668


« Reply #199 on: December 28, 2011, 12:07:26 AM »

Dreatx:

As you hang here longer you will see that GM really has thought about and experienced these issues quite a bit more than most people.

However, to even things out in the conversation (a self-imposed handicap as it were) and led by the temptation of his genuine skills in the Art of Snark,  he has selected the distinctive approach to the Art of Persuasion you see on display here.

Perhaps it is a rough and tumble stationhouse humor with which he communicates?  Or an irritated world- weariness in dealing for the hundredth time what is relatively fresh to you?  Who knows?

Anyway, may I suggest you just ignore the snark and stick around for the merit lurking behind it?  He may miss some of what you bring, but , , , so what? 

 cheesy

TAC!
Marc

 
Logged
Pages: 1 2 3 [4] 5 6 ... 8 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!