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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #250 on: February 03, 2009, 02:03:26 AM »

NSAC Comments:

Monday, February 02, 2009
by Brian Knapp (bknapp@sherdog.com)

16028
The sweat had not yet dried when accusations began to fly against welterweight champion Georges St. Pierre after his lopsided victory against B.J. Penn in the UFC 94 main event on Saturday at the MGM Grand Garden Arena in Las Vegas.

Not long after his win, St. Pierre and his corner, including trainer Greg Jackson, came under fire for allegedly using a “greasing” agent between rounds. Nevada State Athletic Commission Executive Director Keith Kizer on Monday confirmed improprieties had occurred in the champion’s corner after the first and second rounds.

“After the first round, one of my inspectors came to me and told me he thought he saw one of the cornermen -- I believe it was Phil Nurse … after putting Vaseline on [St. Pierre’s] face, he saw him rub his shoulders, and it appeared as though he might not have wiped off his hands,” Kizer said. “After the second round, we observed Mr. Jackson putting Vaseline on Mr. St. Pierre’s face and then putting his hand on his back.”

At that point, Kizer attempted to get Jackson’s attention from outside the cage.

“I don’t think he heard me because of all the noise in the arena, so I immediately walked into the Octagon myself -- I’ve probably done that two other times in my career -- and told him to take his hand off Mr. St. Pierre’s back,” he said. “We took a towel and wiped off his back. After the third round, we went in again and made sure his back and shoulders were wiped off to ensure a level playing field.”

Kizer informed Penn’s camp of the situation after the bout ended. Penn’s manager and brother, J.D., told Sherdog.com on Sunday that the Hawaiian’s camp planned to file a complaint with the NSAC, but, as of Monday afternoon, Kizer had not heard from Penn’s representatives. Penn has 10 days to file.

Nevertheless, Kizer admonished Jackson and Nurse after the match.

“I told them I was disappointed and that they may have tainted Mr. St. Pierre’s victory,” he said. “I told them if it happens again, it will probably be the last time they work a corner in Nevada. Basically, they said, ‘Look, we’re sorry. We’re not trying to do anything. It was an accident.’ Whether it was intentional or not, I don’t know. It was improper.”

According to St. Pierre’s trainer, Greg Jackson, the controversy surrounding the bout has been blown out of proportion. Jackson addressed the accusations on the Monday edition of the Savage Dog Show on the Sherdog Radio Network.

“The controversy came because people didn’t know what they were looking at,” he said. “Steve Friend, ‘The Witch Doctor,’ he works with a ton of these guys, and he has this energy stuff [he does]. In between rounds, Phil [Nurse] put Vaseline on Georges’ head; then he’s supposed to reach around and rub something or tap something … I don’t know how it exactly works. On the outside, it looks like, ‘Why is he rubbing his back?’ And you don’t know why. ‘Oh, he’s putting Vaseline on. That’s got to be it.’”

St. Pierre punished Penn for four rounds, as he took him down numerous times and passed his guard with unthinkable ease. By the end of the fourth -- after Penn had absorbed a lethal dose of ground-and-pound -- the Hawaiian’s corner motioned to the cage-side doctor to stop the fight.

“On B.J.’s side, you just got beat, and you got beat pretty well,” Jackson said. “You gotta have something to hold onto. There’s gotta be a reason I got beat. They have to hold onto something, and I think they’re holding onto this.”

Jackson -- who also trains UFC light heavyweight champion Rashad Evans -- vehemently denies any intentional wrongdoing took place in the corner in between rounds.

“We certainly don’t need to cheat to win,” he said. “If we were going to put Vaseline on his back, it wouldn’t be like a tapping little thing. We’d take some Vaseline and make it count, you know what I mean? We don’t do that. We don’t cheat.

“It’s really a non-issue to me because there are cameras everywhere; there are inspectors everywhere,” he continued. “I’m not the smartest guy, but I’m not a moron. I wouldn’t grease someone between rounds.”

One of the sport’s most visible and respected trainers, Jackson thinks St. Pierre’s performance may have worked against him in terms of giving the controversy legs. No one had ever defeated Penn so soundly before.

“When you’ve got a guy as good as Georges and people are looking, like, ‘How can this guy be so good?’ People are going to find controversy somewhere at some point,” Jackson said. “Georges was, like, ‘What are you talking about? That’s ridiculous. I worked really hard.’ It’s nice for us because we know we didn’t cheat. We know what happened that night. To me, it’s not really a big deal when you have the truth on your side.”

Not surprisingly, the Jackson’s Submission Fighting founder indicated the otherworldly St. Pierre would invite a third fight with Penn if there was doubt about the legitimacy of his victory.

“I’m sure he wouldn’t mind fighting B.J. a third time if they’re that concerned about it,” Jackson said. “I’m sure everybody would make a lot of money, and we’d certainly welcome that fight again.”

Jackson expects the furor surrounding their rematch to die down soon.

“There’s not a lot of validity to it,” Jackson said. “It wasn’t a close fight where people were like, ‘Oh, if it wasn’t for all the cheating they did …’ I think it will just blow over once people realize what the truth was.”

Kizer was uncertain as to whether or not the incidents impacted the match. The first time St. Pierre and Penn met, the outcome was far less one-sided, as the French Canadian took a split decision at UFC 58 in 2006.

“It’s hard to tell,” he said. “I don’t think it takes away the victory, but I think it takes away from the victory. You’ve got to be better than that.”
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Ronin
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« Reply #251 on: February 03, 2009, 07:20:06 AM »

Yeah, it wasn't the punches to the face, it wasn't GSP dominating, it wasn't GSP superiour conditioning, it was vasaline.
yep, I also have a bridge to sell if any is interested.
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #252 on: February 03, 2009, 11:01:50 AM »

Although I did see BJ try to establish lockdown one time (and here vasaline vel non would be relevant), I agree it probably didn't make a difference in the fight.

That said, I think it important to establish that cheating will not be tolerated lest this sport become like boxing.
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #253 on: February 03, 2009, 07:54:42 PM »

Nevada State Athletic Commission Executive Director Keith Kizer today reported today that an improper application of Vaseline to St. Pierre's back by his cornermen has already merited a stern warning from the commission, and further actions may follow.

"There was no need for it," Kizer said of the incident in question. "It was disturbing. Where it goes from here, if anything, I don't know."

"The first round, one of the inspectors that was on the outside of the cage came over to me and said it looked to him that when the cornerman, who I think in that case was Phil Nurse, put the Vaseline on Georges' face then rubbed his shoulders -- which you see the guys rubbing the other guy's shoulders to help him out -- he didn't wipe off his hands between doing that. I said, 'Well, I'm going to watch very closely after this round.'"

"At the end of the second round I watched, and then another cornerman who I believe was Greg Jackson, he put the Vaseline on Georges' face, and then he put his hand on his back to do the breathing thing they always do. As soon as I saw that, it looked like there was still some Vaseline on his hand. Not a lot, but still some."

"Tony Liano and I immediately yelled at him, and I don't think he heard us because of the noise. So I actually went into the octagon, and I said, 'Take your hand off of his back. What are you doing?' We wiped it down. We made sure it was wiped down after the third round as well. This was after the second when I was in there. I was very upset. I don't know if they were doing it intentionally or not. Either way, they shouldn't have done it."

"I came out of the octagon and explained to the commissioner what I saw. I also motioned toward (UFC President) Dana (White) and (UFC co-owner) Lorenzo (Fertitta) so they'd know what I was doing in there. After the fight, actually both Mr. White and Mr. Fertitta both commented on how they're not sure whether those guys need to corner any other UFC (events) ever again. I leave that to them from a company standpoint. We'll deal with it from a commission standpoint."

"It wasn't necessary, it definitely wasn't fair to Mr. Penn. I don't think it was even fair to Mr. St. Pierre."

"His cornerman should have been more careful if it was an accident. If it was intentional, that's even worse. Just very, very disturbing."

"I found out this morning -- I talked with another inspector of mine -- he said that apparently B.J. Penn had complained to the inspector in his corner after either the first or second round that he though maybe Georges was a little slippery. I found that out this morning. At the same time he was complaining we were actually handling the situation in Georges' corner. It's just unfortunate."

"It wasn't like [St. Pierre's cornerman's] hand was covered in Vaseline, but he went directly from the face to the shoulders. By itself it's not a problem, but if there was still some Vaseline residue on, which there very well could have been, you've got to be more careful than that."

"Again, I don't know if that was a trick they were trying to play on us or not, but regardless, it's improper. We took the action we did after the second and third round."

"If they do file something, we'll obviously deal with it in due course. Whether or not the commission wants to do anything on their own initiative, other than what we've already done, obviously, in giving them a very, very stern warning, (I don't know)."

"Anytime you have disciplinary action, it could involve a suspension. It could involve a fine. It could involve a revocation. But it's a little premature to be talking about that."

"They can definitely file a complaint against the cornerman, but that's probably it. I don't know. We'll see. I don't see any basis to protest the decision, but you can definitely complain against the actions of the cornerman."

"My understanding is there's four ways you can overturn a decision. There's a scoring error. There's some sort of collusion; you know, someone paid off a judge, etc. The third is a positive drug test, and the fourth is the referee misinterpreted the rules. For example if you had the old boxing rule of three knockdowns in a round and after the third knockdown the referee says, 'Hey the fighter's fine. He can continue,' and he ends up winning the fight, you can overturn it then because the referee misinterpreted the rules. So I don't see any basis here."

"The example I give is Gaylord Perry of the (San Diego) Padres back in the day was known for putting Vaseline on the ball. The umpires did their best. Let's say it's the eighth inning and his team is up 10-0, he's throwing a shutout, and they find out on some pitch that he put Vaseline on the ball. They take action against him, but that wouldn't invalidate the rest of the game, although you could argue maybe he used it on every pitch and got this 10-run lead."

"But again, the Penns have the right to file whatever they're going to file, and we'd look into it and see if there is any basis for whatever they asked for."

"We wiped [St. Pierre] down very, very hard and even after the end of the third round, even though there was no touching of his back with Vaseline, we still wiped him down again after that round, too, just to be safe. You do the best you can to make it back to an even playing field and go from there."

"And I did tell the cornermen that if we ever see this again, that's it for them. I don't know the outcome of this specific incident, but we definitely gave them a warning that if we ever see that happen again that's probably the last time they'd be cornering in Nevada. As far as cornering in the UFC elsewhere, I'll leave that to the owners of the UFC."

"It's just an unfortunate incident. No fight needs it, especially a fight of this caliber."

"The fans can make their own conclusions on what they felt from their aspect. They saw what I saw for the most part based on some of the .gifs (small video clips) out there showing what happened.

"This may have tainted [St. Pierre's] victory in the eyes of many fans, and it's his cornerman's fault for that. It doesn't take away his victory, but it does take away from his victory in the eyes of many fans, I believe."

(source: mmajunkie.com)
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Ronin
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« Reply #254 on: February 04, 2009, 08:55:52 AM »

IF at any point DURING the match BJ thought that there was a problem, he could have made it clear to the ref.
He didn't.
This looks rather unprofessional.
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #255 on: February 04, 2009, 11:27:31 AM »

Quote
IF at any point DURING the match BJ thought that there was a problem, he could have made it clear to the ref.
He didn't.
This looks rather unprofessional.

I think BJ was too busy getting hit to notice or wonder what was going on and if I read everything right, it was a member of the NSAC who noticed it first. Ill go back and read but the fact that someone from the commission had to jump up during the fight and wipe GSP off seems unprofessional to me.  IT may have not changed the outcome and the better man won but let not ignore the fact that what the corner man did was wrong.

If you watch Dana's video blog he's already pissed at the end of the match and asks Rashad Evans about that the vaseline.

Im not here to say BJ would have won if it wasn't for the vaseline, it's just a shame that GSP victory may be tainted.

Even Matt Hughes stated GSP felt greasy
http://www.cagepotato.com/it-had-happen-matt-hughes-says-gsp-%E2%80%9Cfelt-greasy%E2%80%9D

But then again you have to take it with a grain of sale since Matt Hughes lost.  Im not sure when that article came out I cant find the date, and like the article says maybe it is a chance to dig at GSP since he lost.

The following article lists others with complaints about someone being greased up.

http://www.mmatorch.com/artman2/publish/Staff_Editorials_19/article_1931.shtml
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Ronin
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« Reply #256 on: February 04, 2009, 11:42:42 AM »

Quote
IF at any point DURING the match BJ thought that there was a problem, he could have made it clear to the ref.
He didn't.
This looks rather unprofessional.

I think BJ was too busy getting hit to notice or wonder what was going on and if I read everything right, it was a member of the NSAC who noticed it first. Ill go back and read but the fact that someone from the commission had to jump up during the fight and wipe GSP off seems unprofessional to me.  IT may have not changed the outcome and the better man won but let not ignore the fact that what the corner man did was wrong.

If you watch Dana's video blog he's already pissed at the end of the match and asks Rashad Evans about that the vaseline.

Im not here to say BJ would have won if it wasn't for the vaseline, it's just a shame that GSP victory may be tainted.

Even Matt Hughes stated GSP felt greasy
http://www.cagepotato.com/it-had-happen-matt-hughes-says-gsp-%E2%80%9Cfelt-greasy%E2%80%9D

But then again you have to take it with a grain of sale since Matt Hughes lost.  Im not sure when that article came out I cant find the date, and like the article says maybe it is a chance to dig at GSP since he lost.

The following article lists others with complaints about someone being greased up.

http://www.mmatorch.com/artman2/publish/Staff_Editorials_19/article_1931.shtml

Where was the ref during all this? I mean he is right there, if ANYONE can see something "not right" its the ref.
The way that its being talked about you'd think that GSP was slicker than dog shit on a lenonium floor.
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #257 on: February 04, 2009, 01:12:03 PM »

Arvloski to box?

http://www.cagepotato.com/arlovski-signs-golden-boy-will-box-next-and-why-not

Following his knockout loss to Fedor Emelianenko at Affliction: Day of Reckoning, Andrei Arlovski has signed with Golden Boy Promotions and will begin his career as a boxer, reports FightHype.com. 

You may recall that Arlovski’s trainer, Freddie Roach, said he’d like to see Arlovski take on heavyweight boxing champ Nikolai Valuev if he was victorious against Fedor.  Of course, he wasn’t, so maybe Valuev won’t be Arlovski’s first opponent, which is probably just as well.  But whoever he does face in the boxing ring, at least he won’t be tempted to try another flying knee.

If you’re Arlovski this move makes perfect sense right now.  Having lost to Fedor, there’s no immediately obvious opponent for him outside the UFC ranks.  He’s already beaten Ben Rothwell and Roy Nelson, Josh Barnett has the next shot at Fedor (though it won’t happen until the summer, at the earliest), so why not put on some bigger gloves and find out whether Roach really knows a boxing diamond in the rough when he sees it?

The upside for MMA fans is we get to see someone from our world match his skills against a real boxer.  We’ve all heard about how superior their striking is for so long, wouldn’t it be nice to find out the old-fashioned way?  Not to mention, this could actually get people to care about boxing’s heavyweight division again, at least for a little while.
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #258 on: February 06, 2009, 02:50:49 AM »

Uh oh.... Just in from BJ's site ... will it happen?

BJ Penn accepts GSP and Greg Jackson’s challenge
# Posted by BJ PENN on February 5, 2009 at 10:29pm

For the past several days I have been reading statements made by St. Pierre and Greg Jackson about our fight on January 31. St. Pierre claims that he is “not a cheater” and that he and Greg Jackson will have “no problem with a rematch in the summer of 2009.” To the untrained eye the grease might not look like much, but every grappler knows the effect that it has. Being able to apply your submissions and sweeps or just being able to hold on to your opponent to defend yourself from being hit is absolutely critical! There is a reason why you are not allowed to put grease anywhere on your body except for the area around your eyes. Because of the grease applied to St.Pierre’s Body the Nevada State Athletic Commission’s executive director, Keith Kizer has stated that the Penn-St. Pierre fight “definitely wasn’t fair”. I hereby accept George St. Pierre and Greg Jackson’s challenge for a fight in the summer 2009. Lets call Dana now and set it up.

- BJ Penn
« Last Edit: February 06, 2009, 04:06:20 AM by Robertlk808 » Logged

"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Chad
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« Reply #259 on: February 06, 2009, 10:00:05 AM »

Anyone excited about Saturday? http://www.ufc.com/index.cfm?fa=EventDetail.FightCard&eid=1875

I always enjoy watching Danzig, and the main event might be good. Any predictions, or any one particular fight look to be good?
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #260 on: February 06, 2009, 11:25:59 AM »

Glenn Danzig  huh   Bad joke..

I like watching Mac Danzig fight, he started to irk me during the TUF show but now that he isnt trapped inside a house he seems to have lightened up.
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Guard Dog
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« Reply #261 on: February 06, 2009, 03:06:22 PM »

I'm sick of MMA.  undecided
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Sisco T.
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« Reply #262 on: February 06, 2009, 06:28:48 PM »

 i LOVE mma.

 i am (was) a BIG bj penn fan, but i hope he gets this GSP rematch just so GSP can dominate him again! i dont think that vaseline had much if ANY impact on that fight at all.


  Francisco
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #263 on: February 18, 2009, 08:13:17 AM »

http://www.sherdog.com/news/news/leopoldo-arrested-on-drug-possession-16233
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Chad
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« Reply #264 on: February 18, 2009, 11:01:24 AM »

http://www.ufc.com/index.cfm?fa=eventDetail.fightCard&eid=1877

2/21 Saturday night... and it's totally free on SPIKE (even Ryan can't hate on that  cheesy ). Nigthmare has been a favorite of mine forever hope he does well.
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Chad
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« Reply #265 on: February 24, 2009, 04:13:58 PM »

Good fights Sat. better than some I've paid for. Most were finished quickly. The main event was a really well matched fight.
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #266 on: February 26, 2009, 08:05:08 PM »

http://sherdog.com/news/articles/mayeda-examines-mmas-role-in-society-16313

Wednesday, February 25, 2009
by Danny Acosta

16313
Fights inside and outside the cage and ring fall under the mixed martial arts umbrella. For David Mayeda, MMA has become as much about responsibility as excitement.

The “human cockfighting” phrase still reverberates, despite support from mainstream advertisers like Nike, Bud Light and Microsoft. Mayeda, who earned his PhD in American Studies from the University of Hawaii, set out to explore MMA’s place in society in 2005 after coming to know the sport through “The Ultimate Fighter” reality series.

“I knew, even though I was seduced by mixed martial arts as a fan, it potentially could have differing effects on society in terms of violence,” said Mayeda, who has placed his academic focus on violence prevention geared toward youth.

“Fighting for Acceptance: Mixed Martial Artists and Violence in American Society” was published in February 2008. Mayeda took his theses from print to film when he directed, co-produced and narrated the documentary “MMA 808: Inside Hawaii’s Fight Game,” which was later derived from his book.

“I’m going to stick to my assertion that because MMA is the closest thing to the complete sport of fighting, it holds -- the sport as a whole holds -- a broader social responsibility,” he said. “That overlap between MMA and street school or domestic violence is the most striking concern for me socially. I’d like to see the MMA community take a broader responsibility in distancing the sport from those types of violence and sending out the right social messages to prevent those types of violence.”

MMA enthusiasts charge Mayeda with taking the sport backward by acknowledging its warts. Detractors, on the other hand, view him as an apologist.

The Hawaiian recognizes reluctance to be honest about the sport because of the obstacles it has had to overcome to become accepted in the mainstream. If the UFC applies its marketing muscle to social issues, it can make a visible impact, according to Mayeda. He was pleased with UFC Fight Night 16 “Fight for the Troops” in December and hopes the show serves as the first step in significant social involvement.

Balance between violence and the “feel good” story seems paramount, and the former high school football player points to the NFL as a potential model for the UFC. That organization -- the most popular and powerful professional sports entity in America -- also walks arm-in-arm with violence.

“They have really strong charitable organizations that they promote during their commercials during their games,” Mayeda said.

Responsibility does not rest solely with the UFC. If an MMA promotion can profit from a community, it can give back to it, as well. Mayeda offered one startling example of MMA doing its best to curb violence. In Kailua, Hawaii, more than a year ago, a man beat his ex-girlfriend to death with the butt of his gun. MMA Hawaii executives who run MMA Hawaii Magazine and mmahawaii.com recognized the perpetrator as one of the spectators at an event they sponsored.

Photo courtesy of MMAHawaii.com

Kala Kolohe Hose
and the HSCADV.
In response, MMA Hawaii initiated partnerships with the Hawaii State Coalition Against Domestic Violence and Mothers Against Drunk Driving. MMA Hawaii Magazine also enlisted Icon Sport middleweight champion Kala Hose and had him pose with his daughter under the caption: “You love your daughter. You want to give her the world. Start by treating her mother with respect. Real fighters keep it in the ring.” Mayeda thinks responsible fighters should speak out against domestic violence, drunken driving, substance abuse and other social ailments more often.

Even with island MMA in recovery after the extended absence of Rumble on the Rock and Icon Sport -- Mayeda believes MMA was more popular in 2001 than it is now -- ads like the one involving Hose do more than educate fans; they educate lawmakers, too. It frustrates Mayeda that similar campaigns are not already fixtures in the sport.

“I think those icons need to be pushed, not just as athletes but as humanitarians, as well,” he said. “I think that can do a lot to change the culture of mixed martial arts.”

Mayeda thinks MMA has the power to use its popularity to bring about positive change. He and Antonio McKee -- a former International Fight League standout who also works with children in his community -- agree that youth violence prevention programs involving MMA appeal to at-risk kids because it provides a release through which they can draw on their physical abilities. However, advancing the culture of MMA has many obstacles, and one -- “The Ultimate Fighter” -- stands out above all the rest.

Each installment of the Spike TV reality series brings promising talent to the UFC. What happens along the way perturbs Mayeda. The fights may not be official, but UFC President Dana White’s presence -- along with prominent fighters serving as coaches -- makes the show a representation of the UFC, in particular, and MMA, in general. It has a heavy influence on first impressions.

“They already have the [male] 20- and 30-something demographic kind of hooked,” Mayeda said. “So I don’t know that ‘The Ultimate Fighter’ is bringing new fans from that demographic. They need to be reaching out to an older demographic, men and women.”

Mayeda sees it as a tug-of-war between long-term investment and a shortsighted play for ratings and cash. He points again to the NFL, which puts together family-friendly events despite the inherent violence associated with football. MMA role models abound, according to Mayeda.

“[Rosi Sexton has] a 2-year-old child and [is an] 8-1 mixed martial artist with a PhD,” he said.

Mayeda now watches traditional MMA programming as he continues his advocacy for a sport still struggling to find its identity. The more he speaks out, the more criticism he receives. His is a thankless job. Mayeda no longer watches “The Ultimate Fighter,” even though it brought him to MMA. He suggests Junie Allen Browning’s antics on the most recent season countered the UFC’s efforts to keep negative images -- like the infamous Noah Thomas-Marlon Sims street fight on season five -- under wraps. Mixed signals are being sent.

“It’s hard to reconcile that inconsistency,” Mayeda said. “It’s like ‘Jackass’ the movie for the series. They’re really helping to create that ambiance. I just don’t understand anymore. They should have learned from TUF 1. They’re not evolving. They’re devolving.”

Mayeda wants MMA to borrow from traditional martial arts. Teach it for discipline, self defense and self-esteem building. Teach younger students more grappling than striking. Build family relationships and educational goals.

“Those are the things that martial arts schools are known for doing,” he said. “If MMA schools can capture that identity and really pursue those goals, it’ll have a much easier time gaining acceptance across the country.”
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #267 on: March 06, 2009, 12:24:14 PM »

Jackson-Jardine:  Predictions?
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Chad
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« Reply #268 on: March 06, 2009, 01:52:43 PM »

Jackson-Jardine:  Predictions?


I'll take rampage in the 2nd by TKO.
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foxmarten
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« Reply #269 on: March 06, 2009, 08:52:25 PM »

My money is on the Dean of Mean.  I think he will take Rampage out with a liver shot (kick) in the third.
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #270 on: March 06, 2009, 09:54:10 PM »

At this point I doubt Jackson pyschologically/emotionally.
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #271 on: March 07, 2009, 04:44:00 AM »

If Jardine wins I'll have to believe the "Just showing up is half the battle" saying to its fullest.  I don't think I've ever seen a sloopier light heavyweight. . . ever.
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #272 on: March 07, 2009, 05:44:29 AM »

I must be getting even older and more out of date.

"Sloopier"?  huh
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Chad
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« Reply #273 on: March 07, 2009, 12:28:10 PM »

I'll be at work tonight so I will probably be watching this instead of Jackson KTFOing Jardine.  cheesy


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Marc De La Cruz vs. Darren Crisp
Mike Craddock vs. Hector Alatorre
Chad Sutton vs. Eli Moreno
Nikk Covert vs. Billy Terry
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Chad
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« Reply #274 on: March 08, 2009, 12:07:15 PM »

Sun Mar 08, 2009 10:00 am EDT

White says officiating in MMA is terrible, there's only three good refs
By Steve Cofield

The officiating inside the cage at UFC 96 was a big topic in the aftermath. Referee Rick Fike started the night off in dubious fashion and Yves Lavigne almost got Pete Sell killed. That prompted UFC president Dana White to go on a tiraDe. He's so unhappy with the state of officiating in mixed martial arts that he stated there's only three good referees. And even those guys, he had trouble recalling.

Watch White talk about the refs and how he hurt his arm: http://sports.yahoo.com/mma/blog/cagewriter/post/White-says-officiating-in-MMA-is-terrible-there?urn=mma,146522
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foxmarten
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« Reply #275 on: March 08, 2009, 01:00:44 PM »

As far as the refs go, I guess you get what you pay for.  Seems like a sport with this high a PPV gross could afford some full time guys. 

From the Washington Post (the rest of the article is pretty informative)

Today Yamasaki does about 15 events a year for various state athletic commissions, two or three fights each card. (Referees do not work for the UFC or other promotions.) He makes $1,000 per event in Nevada, a couple hundred more in California and New Jersey. The perks are few: a nice hotel; UFC swag; low-watt, pay-per-view celebrity. Mostly, his reward is to get splattered with blood, yelled at by drunks and bashed on fanboy Web sites. On the forums of Sherdog.com, a popular MMA site, Yamasaki can't ever seem to win -- he is described as both the "early stoppage king" and the guy who needs a "near-death KO for him to stop a fight."

"You've got two guys' lives in your hands," UFC president Dana White says about being an MMA ref. "It's the hardest job in sports."

Yamasaki doesn't care. "I'd do it for free," he says. "That's how much I love it."

Other than John McCarthy, MMA's longest-tenured ref and one of Yamasaki's close friends, Yamasaki has more experience than any ref in the sport. That doesn't stop controversy from finding him. In 2005, Yamasaki reffed a UFC fight between Phil "the New York Badass" Baroni and Pete "Drago" Sell. In the third round, Sell caught Baroni in a guillotine choke, basically a reverse headlock. A guillotine can put someone out quickly, and Sell had the choke sunk in for about 40 seconds. Because of Baroni's position -- facedown in a corner of the cage -- Yamasaki couldn't see that the fighter had passed out. He couldn't check Baroni's hands to see if they were limp or twitching. "The worst thing for an MMA ref is when a fighter's being choked and he's facedown and you can't see," McCarthy says.

Sell says Baroni was unconscious for much of the 40 seconds. Baroni declined to comment for this story, citing his concern that it might anger Yamasaki. But David Watson, the chief ringside physician for the Nevada Athletic Commission, didn't have the same compunction.

"I had a clear view," Watson says. "It felt to me like eight or 10 seconds longer than I would have liked. But I don't think it hurt Phil in the slightest."

When Sell flipped over, Baroni regained consciousness and tapped out. According to Watson, it wasn't a perilous amount of time to be out. But it looked frightening to spectators, and Yamasaki came under fire. It wasn't the first time. He missed an illegal blow to the groin in a championship fight between Matt Hughes and Frank Trigg. It almost cost Hughes the fight, and Yamasaki was excoriated on Internet forums. Yamasaki admits making mistakes but defends his overall record. "Out of 100 fights, I have maybe three or four questionable calls," he says. "I see things other people don't. I can see when a guy doesn't want to fight."

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/07/10/AR2007071001618.html


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Chad
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« Reply #276 on: March 08, 2009, 02:05:21 PM »

As far as the refs go, I guess you get what you pay for.  Seems like a sport with this high a PPV gross could afford some full time guys.

I think they are paid by the athletic commission to keep a certain level of impropriety. I'm not sure I would be cool with the UFC paying this guys directly, or even giving bonuses for title bouts or the like. Best to keep the organization and the commission completely seperate, IMHO.
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #277 on: March 11, 2009, 09:32:44 PM »

I hope the discussion about referees will keep going.

Changing subjects for the moment, how did the Jackson-Jardine fight go?  The other fights?
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Rctrue
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« Reply #278 on: March 17, 2009, 12:54:31 PM »

It was an excellent card.

Shane Carwin KOd Gonzaga 69 seconds into the first round brininging his record to 11-0 all KOs. Nobodies made it out of the first round with him. Shane is a phenom and one of the most gifted athletes in the country. He reminds me of a younger, faster, stronger Randy Couture. He will definitely go far in the sport.

Matt Hamill headkicked Munoz harder than Ive ever seen, earning him a $60,000 KO of the night bonus.

The Rampage fight was great. He seemed a bit hesitant to pull the trigger even when he had Jardine hurt. Big respect to both fighters. Rampage won by decision.

Rampage and Rashad had a s**t talking session in the cage after the fight to hype their title fight, but it turns out Rampage is going to wait and fight the winner of Rashad Evans Vs Lyoto Machida for the belt. If Rampage would've taken the title fight in May that would be his 3rd fight in 5 months!!


Besides the officiating it was an excellent card. Not one submission the entire night.

The refs need to be more consistent. I mean one fight got stopped way to early, even Dana was mad, and during the Brown Vs Sell fight Sell took massive amounts of unneeded damage. Even Matt Brown was yelling at the ref. Dana was  hurt his arm trying to get the ref to stop it.  Big John really was the best ref in the game.

How long do you guys think Machida will hold the belt? Could be along time if he beats Page

PS. My names Rich and I have massive amounts of respect for the tribe. Hopefully one day I can get to Ca and participate.

« Last Edit: March 17, 2009, 12:57:40 PM by Rctrue » Logged
Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #279 on: March 17, 2009, 03:05:16 PM »

Woof Rich:

Thanks for taking the time for a quality report.

I remember fondly training with Lyoto at RAW Gym a few years back.  Very nice guy, class act.  His fighting exemplifies DB Kali Tudo Trigg 101 and Trigg 102.

Look forward to meeting you at our Gatherings.  90% of Life is showing up  wink

TAC!
CD
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Rctrue
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« Reply #280 on: March 18, 2009, 10:10:03 PM »

Woof

Thanks for the response! Its an honor talking to you guys. Crafty Dog you are definitely a highly respected martial artist in my book, and I share the same view points as you on alot of things. It would be an honor to meet you in person. It is my goal to attend one.

Training with Lyoto Machida would be amazing! He has pinpoint accuracy, his elusiveness makes him almost untouchable, and he can roll with the best of them. Truly well rounded, and definitely ahead of his time.

Its amazing to me that his primary trainer is his father. I think they train Shotokan?
I know his resumé is incredible! BJ Penn, Rich Franklin, Sokoudjou, Tito Ortiz, Thiago Silva, etc. I dont see him getting beat anytime soon.

What are your thoughts on Fedor Emelianenko? He is probably my favorite fighter, but I really want to see him sign with the UFC so we can see him fight people like Randy, Brock, and Carwin. I do think his next fight against Josh Barnett will be his toughest fight to date.

Respect to all from Nebraska,
Rich

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Tom Stillman
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« Reply #281 on: March 18, 2009, 11:49:28 PM »

Hey Rich, Welcome aboard bro! cool  Dog Tom
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« Reply #282 on: March 26, 2009, 05:46:55 PM »

Can't wait for this one....

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Tom Stillman
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« Reply #283 on: March 28, 2009, 05:52:13 PM »

I am watching "The Ultimate Fighter" tv show right now. As I post this, there is a guy  named Tait Fletcher getting ready to fight . Among other things, he said he trains with an underground stick fighting group in Hermosa Beach. I wonder who that could be?  grin 
« Last Edit: March 28, 2009, 06:35:16 PM by Tom Stillman » Logged

Live a good, honorable life. Then when you get older and think back, you'll be able to enjoy it a second time.  dalai lama
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« Reply #284 on: March 28, 2009, 07:15:29 PM »

For reasons not know to us, it is our understanding that his specific use of our name was edited out.  huh rolleyes
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Sebresos
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« Reply #285 on: March 29, 2009, 07:15:57 AM »

I was watching Re-runs of Ultimate Fighter, Tait came of as snooty and sarcastic to me.
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Tom Stillman
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« Reply #286 on: March 29, 2009, 03:40:07 PM »

I don't think snooty so much. Just pumped up a little.  BTW,  I feel he was robed of the win by bad judging.  He clearly dominated that fight!  IMHO
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Live a good, honorable life. Then when you get older and think back, you'll be able to enjoy it a second time.  dalai lama
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« Reply #287 on: April 07, 2009, 02:34:27 AM »

Frank Shamrock Vs Nick Diaz this Saturday on Showtime. I think Frank can win this one, but he needs to keep it standing. Diaz has great BJJ.

What do you guys think?
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Blackwolf_101
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« Reply #288 on: April 07, 2009, 07:04:38 AM »

I like Frank, he has a Lot of skill and on paper should be able to pull this one out. Hopefully he learned from the the Cung Le  fight to not let his ego get the better of him and try and fight the other guys fight. i also Like Nick though Its a hard fight for me to pick but I think you are Right. If it goes to the ground Nick May have the advantage  if they keep it standing frank may be able to pull it off.
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« Reply #289 on: April 08, 2009, 06:17:14 AM »

 i like nick diaz. i just think, even at 35-36 years of age, F. shamrock is too athletic and has too much game for nick. could be wrong- we'll find out this saturday. gonna be a GOOD fight.

 Francisco
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Sebresos
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« Reply #290 on: April 12, 2009, 12:56:56 AM »

Well, looks like we were all wrong. Shamrock got whooped! embarassed
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Sebresos
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« Reply #291 on: April 15, 2009, 02:11:43 AM »

Shamrock got paid 370,000 for that beating. Nick Diaz around 39,000.
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Stickgrappler
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« Reply #292 on: April 15, 2009, 12:52:35 PM »

i dont have a link handy, but apparently frank shamrock had some busted ribs prior to the fight. i guess now knowing his payout, why he continued with the fight and not sit it out.
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"A good stickgrappler has good stick skills, good grappling, and good stickgrappling and can keep track of all three simultaneously. This is a good trick and can be quite effective." - Marc "Crafty Dog" Denny
Sebresos
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« Reply #293 on: April 15, 2009, 02:19:34 PM »

I think Frank Shamrocks done. He could still fight of course, but not at the level everyone is at now in professional MMA. I read on Sherdog today that Lyoto Machida thinks Anderson Silva could take Fedor, if Fedor came down to 220 lbs. Lyoto stated that Anderson Silva's usually walks around at 215. I don't think Silva could hurt Fedor on the ground, even though he's a black belt in BJJ. Standing up, I think Fedor been in the ring with stronger fighters, i.e. , Crocop, Hunt. But then again I felt Frank Shamrock was going to knock out Diaz. Nothings a sure bet in MMA.
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Stickgrappler
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« Reply #294 on: April 15, 2009, 03:41:03 PM »

on any given day, any fighter will beat any other fighter
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Sebresos
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« Reply #295 on: April 18, 2009, 11:23:43 AM »

I'll bet anyone here five bucks that someone is going to win the Liddell/Shogun fight tonight. huh
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peregrine
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« Reply #296 on: April 18, 2009, 02:08:43 PM »

I think Frank Shamrocks done. He could still fight of course, but not at the level everyone is at now in professional MMA. I read on Sherdog today that Lyoto Machida thinks Anderson Silva could take Fedor, if Fedor came down to 220 lbs. Lyoto stated that Anderson Silva's usually walks around at 215. I don't think Silva could hurt Fedor on the ground, even though he's a black belt in BJJ. Standing up, I think Fedor been in the ring with stronger fighters, i.e. , Crocop, Hunt. But then again I felt Frank Shamrock was going to knock out Diaz. Nothings a sure bet in MMA.

Stronger opponents yes.
But AS has the best ringmanship which is a major factor in his game.
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Chad
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« Reply #297 on: April 18, 2009, 02:24:21 PM »

I'll bet anyone here five bucks that someone is going to win the Liddell/Shogun fight tonight. huh

I'll take a million to one on that. Always a possibility of a double knockout lol.



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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #298 on: April 18, 2009, 05:09:30 PM »

Now there's a Black Swan Event!   cheesy
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #299 on: April 18, 2009, 06:59:17 PM »

I think I've only ever seen one draw in the UFC . . .
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
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"Smuggling Concepts Across the Frontiers of Style”
ryan@dogbrothers.com | www.dogbrothers.com
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