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Author Topic: Knife vs. Baseball Bat  (Read 15776 times)
AbsOfBrass
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« on: January 02, 2006, 11:57:17 PM »

This is a stupid what if type question, but my brother and I somehow ended up arguing over it anyway... I'm just trying to get some expert opinions and see what most of you think.

Ok, a guy with a knife ( a knife designed to fight with, say a K-Bar) and a guy with a baseball bat fight, to the death, in an open field. They are both the same size and posses equal strength and athletic aptitude.

In this situation, you have to choose which one of these guys you are, the guy with the bat, or the guy with the K-BAR... ok, so with one would you choose and why?
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #1 on: January 03, 2006, 12:12:57 AM »

Knife.  If the footwork is good a person with a knife should be able to close the distance while/after the person with the bat swings.  


Gruhn
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
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AbsOfBrass
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« Reply #2 on: January 03, 2006, 12:23:21 AM »

That was exactly my take on it as well. My brother (not a martial artist) saw it the other way around.

I figure the knife could close the distance fast enough and probably absorb a jammed swing from the bat because he has a free hand to lessen the damage and sieze the bat or an arm.

Of couse, all of this is possible in my mind only because it takes two hands to swing a bat. I imagine a stick or something you could hit well with one hand would (though probably less damaging) be more effective.
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xtremekali
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« Reply #3 on: January 03, 2006, 09:17:46 PM »

Woof,

IMHO, it depends on who controls the distance. If the knife can bridge the gap then the fight should be his. If not sooner or later the bat will connect and lights out.

Myke
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farranger
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« Reply #4 on: January 24, 2006, 01:34:04 PM »

I'm a new guy here, first post.
I'd think knife for the same reasons above.
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TopDog
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« Reply #5 on: February 07, 2006, 01:19:40 AM »

Knife for me too.  The typical bat is a bit unwieldly for most but the knife had better close quickly!  If the bat gets off a second or third shot things could get pretty grim ....

E
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milt
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« Reply #6 on: February 07, 2006, 10:58:27 AM »

Knife should just keep baiting bat.  Bat will not want to get too close and will probably swing out of range until he tires.   Once knife is confident that bat can no longer swing hard or quickly enough he can go to work.

-milt
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chrismasonic
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« Reply #7 on: February 07, 2006, 01:38:30 PM »

range,
assuming the bat isn't too heavy and thus slow through the air the bat should be able to dispatch the hand weilding a knife,
more surface area to block too...two ends to utilise
for this duel i take the bat.
possibly invert it and use it like you would a bokken.
hmm.
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grizzly
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« Reply #8 on: February 09, 2006, 10:25:41 PM »

The way I understand it is that they are both equal in all areas, I have never fought with a baseball bat, or anything close to real knives, I would go with the baseball bat purely for the longer range factor. If they are in anyway not equal then I would have to side with the knife.
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #9 on: February 09, 2006, 11:55:17 PM »

Let us not forget that these objects can be thrown  wink  Which would you rather have thrown at you?

Gruhn
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
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Dog Brothers Martial Arts Association
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ryan@dogbrothers.com | www.dogbrothers.com
christianvonpraun
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« Reply #10 on: February 10, 2006, 12:58:00 AM »

Quote from: ryangruhn
Let us not forget that these objects can be thrown  wink  Which would you rather have thrown at you?

Gruhn


Don?t you have that game, where you try to hit a thrown ball with a baseball-bat?  Smiley


Christian
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chrismasonic
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« Reply #11 on: February 10, 2006, 04:28:37 AM »

i'd like to see the game where a pitcher throws the knife at the batters face and he has to bat away the knife or wear it like a moustache....
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #12 on: February 10, 2006, 02:06:02 PM »

Hey if a pro baseball player can get beamed anyone can!

Gruhn
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
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Dog Brothers Martial Arts Association
"Smuggling Concepts Across the Frontiers of Style”
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2006, 03:46:20 AM »

I think Dog Milt's analysis to be pretty good-- unless bat man is applying the material from our Staff DVD  rolleyes  wink  cheesy
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carlo
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« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2006, 10:25:01 AM »

"Bat man" Guro Crafty?   Well if it was Batman I'd vote for him.  Seriously, Ive been hit with a hardwood stick.  It didn't stop me, I'm with the knife guys.

I love how this question pops up every few months or so.
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Guard Dog
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« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2006, 11:51:19 AM »

I think we should settle this and try it for ourselves.  Maybe best out of twenty tries.  There are some foam bats at Wal-Mart right now that have some substance to them.  I might pick up a few and see what our group comes up with.  The same thing might have to be tried for the Knife vs. Gun.  Obviously the bat isn?t going to feel like a real bat but we could consider any shots to the head has a ?win.?  Similarly a "bang" with the gun pointed at knife man could be considered a win.


Gruhn
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
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Dog Brothers Martial Arts Association
"Smuggling Concepts Across the Frontiers of Style”
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carlo
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« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2006, 02:12:43 PM »

Hell, forget the bang and put on some safety goggles and whip out the airsoft.  I suspect that it is not a question of the weapon as much as it is a question of initiative and reactionary gap.
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A nation of one ancestry and race is weak. We must hold strong our custom of welcoming all foreigners who seek to join our cause, treating them with dignity and respect and teaching them our language and customs.

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Guard Dog
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« Reply #17 on: February 22, 2006, 02:24:08 PM »

Quote from: carlo
I suspect that it is not a question of the weapon as much as it is a question of initiative and reactionary gap.



YES
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Ryan “Guard Dog” Gruhn
Guro / DBMAA Business Director
Dog Brothers Martial Arts Association
"Smuggling Concepts Across the Frontiers of Style”
ryan@dogbrothers.com | www.dogbrothers.com
bjung
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« Reply #18 on: October 19, 2006, 09:29:55 AM »

i was talking to a guy who works security in Baghdad and while he was a gun guy who spent time training the deployment of his gun, we got to talking about knife use. He mentioned that he and his friends prefered the ASP extendable baton (?) for its range and wallop.
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Dog Greg Brown
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« Reply #19 on: October 19, 2006, 03:15:14 PM »

Good call on that brian. I have to say knife/bat I would go with the knife. If I had the option of an ASP. A short fast moving stick. I would probibly take the asp.

Greg
« Last Edit: October 19, 2006, 04:32:18 PM by Crafty_Dog » Logged
ponytotts
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« Reply #20 on: October 20, 2006, 11:22:59 AM »

i like the asp as well, but i broke one training with it on the tires! shocked
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peregrine
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« Reply #21 on: October 20, 2006, 12:28:06 PM »

in a tight spot like an elevator or room the knife in my opinion wins, if the terrain allows good footwork then possibly the bat.
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #22 on: October 20, 2006, 06:46:06 PM »

Im going with the knife which can be easily redirected and come in at any angle & with the right timing the gap can be closed.

With the bat Im thinking that you would have to work it like the staff and go with the momentum because of the weight at the opposite end to have any kind of flow.

It would be interesting to test out.. Dogzilla? ThaiTom?  Peregrine?



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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
RayFloro
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« Reply #23 on: October 21, 2006, 12:20:51 AM »

I would personally choose the knife..........with a bit of fencing footwork and bridging the distance...
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #24 on: October 21, 2006, 06:35:26 PM »

I personally would choose Ray Floro grin
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #25 on: October 21, 2006, 07:30:15 PM »

Not to detract from the "Bat vs Knife" discussion but since fencing was mentioned.. through browsing another forum someone posted the following link of a Sabre Match.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=1478623914238877457&q=fencing

I think it is really cool to watch footwork, moving forward and backwards. 
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
peregrine
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« Reply #26 on: October 22, 2006, 03:08:33 AM »

I personally would choose Ray Floro grin

me2 we should stand behind him and tactilly cover his back
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RayFloro
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« Reply #27 on: October 22, 2006, 05:34:54 AM »

LMAO @ Crafty Dog and Peregrine  grin cheesy grin cheesy

Seriously though........If Crafty had double baseball bats.....coming at me.........I'd take my knife.........and deftly.......slit my own throat.

He showed me first hand his double stick. The opportunity to spar him brought one thought to my mind...........SCREW THAT!!!

Robert.......thanks for sharing that fencing video.  I utterly enjoyed it.  Although I think that guy with the "cramp" should play soccer instead.
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TomFurman
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« Reply #28 on: October 22, 2006, 06:56:43 PM »

Let's change this to a machete. Reach wins vs a knife, so I would go with a machete. Now a question. Hold the machete with one hand like a Bolo, or two hands like a katana? (Steven Seagal who I really don't like did a nice job in his first film (Above the Law) fighting a gang with a machete holding it with two hands. He even used the butt of the handle to pop some guy in the face at close quarter.)

How long a machete is there available??

Tom Furman
www.physicalstrategies.blogspot.com
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Dog Robertlk808
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« Reply #29 on: October 23, 2006, 12:13:03 AM »

Whew a machete?? I for one would definitely go with the machete. 

If you went with the knife what grip would you use, standard or reverse?
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"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
buzwardo
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« Reply #30 on: October 23, 2006, 11:20:48 AM »

How long a machete is there available??

I've seen 'em up to 26 inches, which is the size of the first one I ever bought. There are also big two handed things with long handles and short blades that I've never used. Bigger ain't better, last 6 inches or so of my first machete fractured while I was cutting branches against a stump. Spent a really long time reshaping the remaining blade--silly as a replacement can be had for 20 bucks--and got more service out of it, but it was a junker I expected to shatter again.

IMO 12 to 18 inches is the best size range, I carry a 12 inch backpacking and battle vegetation around the yard with an 18. Most machetes have fairly crappy steel that dulls up quickly, but edges up quickly, too. I'd be a little spooked about hitting a decent knife with a machete as the knife will contend with less damage. Also, machetes really don't lend themselves to thrusts; you wouldn't want a knifer to get inside on you.

With that said, I'd take the machete, use it with the strong hand, and try to sneak a folder into my weak hand.
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peregrine
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« Reply #31 on: October 23, 2006, 01:22:11 PM »

Whew a machete?? I for one would definitely go with the machete. 

If you went with the knife what grip would you use, standard or reverse?

Yup i definately was wondering on grip and lead, rear hand or lead hand in bot the machete and bat scenario... 
I keep a machete handy in my truck for foilage and random yardwork. There are various types of machetes, cold steel produces several and i actually was going to buy another one this past week, but the lot was bought up by an arborist. For light brush when working fires and yard work i prefer about 20-22" with a weighted tip, either tear drop shaped like a bolo or a cane knife type with a hook on the reverse for catching debris. Remember to wipe the blades clean after use and apply light oil.
http://www.coldsteel.com/machetes.html


machetes reminds me of MS13
http://www.apfn.org/APFN/MS-13.HTM
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