Dog Brothers Public Forum
Return To Homepage
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.
September 20, 2014, 03:07:33 AM

Login with username, password and session length
Search:     Advanced search
Welcome to the Dog Brothers Public Forum.
82557 Posts in 2250 Topics by 1062 Members
Latest Member: seawolfpack5
* Home Help Search Login Register
+  Dog Brothers Public Forum
|-+  DBMA Martial Arts Forum
| |-+  Martial Arts Topics
| | |-+  Condtioning for the stick
« previous next »
Pages: [1] 2 Print
Author Topic: Condtioning for the stick  (Read 15606 times)
peregrine
Power User
***
Posts: 197


« on: March 01, 2006, 11:08:47 PM »

Woof...
people what are your ways of conditioning the body especially the shoulders(rotator cuff) for working with sticks? as well as forearms, grip, etc...

do heavier sticks help much in this regard? or do they just throw your timing off? clubells? rotator cuff work? elastic bands? weights?

i have been an avid weight lifter like many, but the frequent high repetition of the stick and weights combined sure taxes my rotator cuff.
Logged
thai70
Newbie
*
Posts: 41


« Reply #1 on: March 02, 2006, 06:31:42 PM »

start slow.  If you try to swing for the fences right off, you will develop aches and pains that take a long time to go away (shoulders and definately elbows).  Start slow with a regular stick, one you like that isn't too heavy.  Work your way up to the loaded for bear swings.  Trust me on this.  I have dodgy shoulders (rotator cuff issues) and elbows (tendonitis).
tom
Logged
peregrine
Power User
***
Posts: 197


« Reply #2 on: March 05, 2006, 07:15:06 PM »

anyone use clubells? or similar?

i was thinking of making my own and doing some of the movements in the video clips. and or using a 10lbs plate and swing it in a circular type motions as in the clips.
Logged
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #3 on: March 05, 2006, 09:22:39 PM »

I use Clubbells and Kettlebells along with jumpstretch bands. I highly recommend them. The clubbells run from 5lbs all the way up to 80lbs. The heavier ones are for two handed work. With proper instructions they really give the shoulders and increased range of motion and functional strength. The movement called the Two Handed Swipe is like an upperbody squat in that it uses SO many muscle groups.

Kettlebells offer more total body strength with an emphasis on posterior chain work from modified Olympic lifting. (snatch, cleans, jerks, overhead squatting). You can use dumbells and wiffle ball bats full of cement, but once you use the real thing,...it is hard to switch.

---Tom Furman
Logged
peregrine
Power User
***
Posts: 197


« Reply #4 on: March 05, 2006, 10:06:19 PM »

Tom,
excellent response, thanks. would you have some direct links for lifts you use?
right now i just want to work them into my current routine. more of prehab stuff to increae mobility and usable range/strength. i am looking at sonnons site and archives, but so far have only come up with circles in front of the body going both out to in and in to out(anterior to medial...medial to laterally).
i am thinking of doing one around the head as if transitioning from a roof/wing block to a forehand type movement.
i also like the mobility stuff he uses, personally i have like a lot of people lost mobility thru the years especially from lifting heavy weights. i want to gain some of that functional mobility back as it looks awesome for usage in a ground game along with longevity. i am not a sonnon convert but his stuff looks good for my purpose as part of my toolbox.
Logged
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #5 on: March 06, 2006, 08:29:33 AM »

Try parries and reverse parries with the club. Both two handed and one handed. As for the kettlebells. Use the Turkish Getup as a shoulder rehab, prehab. There are a lot more tools, but those should get you started.

--Tom Furman
Logged
carlo
Newbie
*
Posts: 39


« Reply #6 on: March 06, 2006, 10:06:25 AM »








These worked after I injured my shoulder and try this stretch



I use an axe handle when I train, the kind with the plastic cap for more weight though a wood baseballbat is exellent as well.  Do it real slow at first or you are in danger  of blowing out your shoulder or wrists.
Logged

A nation of one ancestry and race is weak. We must hold strong our custom of welcoming all foreigners who seek to join our cause, treating them with dignity and respect and teaching them our language and customs.

-Attila the Hun
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #7 on: March 06, 2006, 05:18:40 PM »

I use pipes as well, but using 25lb clubs kicks ass. Your grip will be transformed and you can control intensity, volume, duration, and frequency. The above exercise, I refer to as a reverse arm wrestler. I have a variation with some new twists on my upcoming DVD. I actually have alot of shoulder oriented stuff on there.

Please note TopDog's post. It is very illuminating.

--Tom Furman
www.physicalstrategies.com
Logged
thai70
Newbie
*
Posts: 41


« Reply #8 on: March 06, 2006, 06:43:14 PM »

Say Tom,
ABout the TGU's.  How should I do them.  Just one on each side and keep switching for time or equal amounts on each side with the 24 kg kbell or go for heavier with the 32kg,  I can do the 24 pretty easily and have done it before for a 10 minute stretch switching side with each rep.  It felt pretty good.
I will take your advice with the clubbells.  I am a teacher and short on cash so I may have to settle for the sand filled whiffle bat.
tom
Logged
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #9 on: March 06, 2006, 07:53:44 PM »

Lucky for me, I have a network of trainers who buy and trade gear like clubbells!

Either approach will work for the Turkish Getup. My wife likes 5 reps per side, then switching. A single on each side for constant switching, long duration is really good as well.

I just did swings with the 72lber, then TGU's for a single each side, then rows for 8 reps, then held a Yoga "plank" for 45 seconds. I did this for several rounds. This is a well rounded workout and alot of fun. Good for stability, mobility, and resiliency. 5 rounds is real good, but build up.


--Tom
Logged
thai70
Newbie
*
Posts: 41


« Reply #10 on: March 07, 2006, 11:45:05 AM »

Thanks tom
I like the swings with the 72lb also.  I currently am trying to get in shape for FLETC, and am cranking out the DOE manMaker witht a 24kg.  I'm up to 190 snatches and 250 squats and am bumping up today.  I ripped the skin off my fingers and the 2 hand swing with the 32kg was an excellant replacement for the one handed snatches.  I also started doing 1 arm rows and standing holds with the kbells.
The kbells have helped my stick work immensely.  Grip is strong, wind is getting better, leg strikes (kangaroo leg shot) is real quick.  I just need to take care of my shoulders, elbows and knees for the academy.
thanks for the help
tom
Logged
Dog Robertlk808
Power User
***
Posts: 544


« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2006, 07:44:36 PM »

Hey Tom, maybe you can bring a set out one of these Saturdays to share with the group? smiley

I think it would be awesome and beneficial for all of us.
Logged

"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #12 on: September 26, 2006, 12:49:28 PM »

Hi Guys,

I believe the best way to get conditioned for stick fighting is by training with sticks.  The first tape"Power" of the Dogbrothers first series contains some excellent training methods.  Lately I've incorporated stick training into my "cardio" training.  Try one round siniwalli on some tires or a heavy bag followed by one round jumprope, continue for 30-40 minutes.  It will do wonders for the muscular endurance of your shoulders and wrist.  The jump rope is a wonderful all around training tool that also makes  you "light " on your feet.  For shoulder prehab I use similar exercises to the ones described in the previous posts.  There is a ton of information on the net on prehab and rehab for shoulders particularly for baseball pitchers.  It is certainly worth googling.

Hope that helps,
Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com     
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #13 on: September 26, 2006, 08:28:54 PM »

Tom:

If you have someone you recommend for getting me going in a KB routine, please email me at Craftydog@dogbrothers.com.  I've really liked what I have tasted so far.

Tony:

Any chance you could save me the legwork and guess work and provide some URLs of shoulder conditioning and rehab for baseball pitchers?

TIA,
CD
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #14 on: September 27, 2006, 08:28:35 AM »

Crafty,

Give me a day or two to retrace my steps and find some links for you.  It will be my pleasure.

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
peregrine
Power User
***
Posts: 197


« Reply #15 on: September 27, 2006, 12:43:09 PM »

Crafty,
a friend was showing me the exercise you do of taking a 25# or so holding it at about eye level then rotating it around your head. It really seems to work the shoulders through a wide range of motion and feels really effective. The clubell guys do a similar thing with the clubs, they call it 'hammer swing'
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #16 on: September 27, 2006, 07:27:59 PM »

Of course, after a warm up set at 25lbs, one moves on to the 45 lb plate  grin 

And yes, it has a feel to it of something very right.
Logged
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #17 on: September 27, 2006, 08:29:30 PM »

Crafty, emails sent on Kbells.

The exercise above is a halo. There are lots of cool things you can do with light weight for mobility.
There is material in Pavel's "Resilient", and my own, soon to be out DVD regarding durability and range of motion.

--Tom
www.physicalstrategies.blogspot.com
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #18 on: September 28, 2006, 03:49:50 PM »

Crafty,

Check these out.  A little something to wet your palate.  I will post more as I stumble across them.

http://www.shoulder1.com/hero/hero.cfm/12/1
http://www.pponline.co.uk/encyc/off-season-training.html
http://www.sportsinjurybulletin.com/prewp/si-shoulder.html

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #19 on: September 30, 2006, 12:55:20 PM »

Thank you.  I will check these out when I get home from Bern.

CD
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #20 on: October 02, 2006, 10:46:06 AM »

Crafty,

Would you please share with us some FMA specific conditioning methods you use?

Thank You,
Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #21 on: October 02, 2006, 03:32:07 PM »

Mysterious elbow pains are sometimes the result of overdosing on gripping the sticks.  The pain actually is not the elbow, but rather the origin of the underworked extensor muscles of the fingers.  The solution is to make a "crane's beak" with your five fingers, put a rubber band around them and then work spreading them for high reps and high speed.  As balance is restored between the flexors and the extensors, the pain in the elbow disappears.

This one I received from Guro Inosanto.
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #22 on: October 03, 2006, 09:54:02 AM »

Thanks for the tip.

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #23 on: October 04, 2006, 09:23:15 AM »

A very interesting read.

http://www.dolfzine.com/page391.htm

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #24 on: October 04, 2006, 11:03:18 AM »

Good piece in many ways.  I agree with his assessment of the importance of the 7 Minute Rotator Cuff Solution.

I have no idea of the merit of his 6 days a week for the same movements methodology.

Where I think he misses a vital point in his analysis is in the foundational role of the hips.  When the hips are tilted forward (due to tight hip flexors (psoas, ilio, quads) and weak peak contraction of the glute-hamstring nexus) -- which is the case with a huge majority of the population due to excessive sitting in modern life, there are consequences for the undelrying alignment of the shoulder joint.  Specifically, it rolls forward.  This is easy to spot in various ways.  One indicator is that when standing the thumbs should be paralell but when the shoulder is rolled forward, the thumbs point inward to varying degrees.  Another indicator is when viewed from the side the ears should be above the shoulders, but when the hips are tilted forward and the shoulders rolled forward, the ears are well in front of the shoulders.  If you point this out to someone, typically he will try to solve it with the neck, but the true solution lies restoring the hips to level.

IMHO to try to solve shoulder problems without also leveling the hips is like peeing into the wind.
Logged
Tony Torre
Power User
***
Posts: 160


« Reply #25 on: October 23, 2006, 05:25:51 PM »

Crafty,

I found this link with some interesting excersises.  http://www.webball.com/power/jobe.html

Tony Torre
Miami Arnis Group
www.miamiarnisgroup.com
Logged
TomFurman
Power User
***
Posts: 99


« Reply #26 on: October 23, 2006, 06:23:55 PM »

Please note Detroit Tiger Sean Casey. His shoulders are fine now. He had problems before. We determined what was going on, and I put stuff in his program last winter that cured his issues. His lower body needs more work this year. I want him at 218 and he is 235.

Tom
www.physicalstrategies.blogspot.com
Logged
Dog Robertlk808
Power User
***
Posts: 544


« Reply #27 on: November 24, 2006, 07:24:11 PM »

I think some of you might find this unique training tool pretty neat.

http://www.torqueblade.com/home? ?<--- Check out the link to see them in action.


The Origins of the Torqueblade:
 
The Torqueblade like any other item dreamed into being was inspired by another. My inspiration came from my experiences in various fitness regimes, military, para military, martial, and numerous civilian. The main underlying thread which I came to appreciate was that of strength to weight ratio and specific endurance for the desired tasks. Always looking for the most cost and time effective regime I realized that the fundamentals of fitness never changed only the intent. In essence training motions rather than muscles seemed more applicable to my daily routines.
Torqueblade training has been influenced by the need for adaptability of impromptu weapons. It can be said that Indian club training has long incorporated this practice by increasing the size and therefore the load of the training tool. The British military adopted these exercises in the 1800's.
 
?Club swinging is believed to have originated in India by soldiers as a method of improving strength, agility, balance and physical ability. During the annexation of India, British officers witnessed the graceful motions and essential property of expanding the chest and exercising every muscle of the body. The British brought the Indian Clubs to Europe where the Germans and Czechs adopted club swinging into their physical training systems?.
Information kindly supplied by DR. ED Thomas of www.motionrx.com
 
 
?The British military, moving with the times decided to upgrade the Royal Navy. The Admiralty at that time replaced sails in favor of steam, to power the new warships. Consequently, labor was not as demanding and the Admiralty perceived a lack of fitness. So the R.N. adopted the training regime of club swinging. To this day the fitness instructors in the R.N. are still referred to as Clubs?.
 
Information kindly supplied by Warrant Officer Richardson P.T.I. (R.N.)
 
I amalgamated my appreciation of blade training with medicine ball type exercises and the training regime of Indian club training.
 
To take you back to the quote of Darwin that ?adaptability ensures a creature?s success? In other words functional training. Or to put it another way ?If you can?t pull yourself out of a hole, what use are you?? (Mind you, seeking and avoiding holes would probably be a better lesson to study?).
 
The conception of the Torqueblade came from two routes, like parallel lines on train track, both heading in the same direction. The two routes are ?Functional Fitness? and the ?Arts of Mars? Martial Arts does actually mean the arts of Mars, the Roman deity of battle and therefore warlike arts both originating from the need to improve certain desired attributes, and both heading towards a similar goal. I originally started designing the Torqueblade from the desire to develop an awkward training tool to enhance adaptability to impromptu weapons. This would also challenge the body?s equilibrium when in motion. These requirements would aide in adaptability.
 
The neuromuscular memory of martial motions must become subtle and effortless. This is the same principle for any sport; the specific motions must become second nature to be effective. The double edged sword of refined body mechanics is that only the essential muscles required for the task are used. Once this is mastered the motions become effortless. If no effort is required the body naturally seeks a new state of rest and your fitness levels start to decline as the pounds start to creep back on.
 
?The human body moves in three planes of motion that of the saggital, frontal and transverse plane. The saggital separates us from left and right, the frontal from back to front and the transverse is a rotational plane that separates from top to bottom?.
Jaun Carlos "JC" Sanatana Director of
The Institue of Human Performance
www.ihpfit.com 561-620-9556
?Everything that we do requires our muscles to work in synergy with each other. Every required task moves through all three planes of motion (multi-planer). Only the intent changes the out come?.
M. Macro
 
I realized that when training with weapons (swords/clubs), students body mechanics improved quicker than when training empty hands alone. The reason for this is that when the equilibrium of the body is challenged by holding an object outside of its natural range of motion the core of the body has to react more quickly to regain balance. This reaction of muscles turning off and on to regain balance is called proprioception.
If in a fight or flight situation, the ability to adapt by way of proprioception my neuromuscular system for an impromptu weapon (if warranted) can be hindered with out proper training, due to the on coming threat and time constraints.
 
?So training in a manner which would prehabilitate my body for such an eventuality would seem to be the ideal way to go?.
 
Training in a traditional gym type setting was not conducive to my requirements. The only exercises which would allow me to train in all planes of motion would be those similar to medicine ball training and those exercises of the Indian Gurus or club swinging. These exercises were be made all the more challenging, with the unique design of the Torqueblade.
 


Examples of insperation

The Torqueblade adopted the weighted tip of the (1) Nepalese ghukri an elongated belly to resemble the shape of the (2) East Indian club and pistol grip of a (3) Philippine blade (kriss).

 
1.?
2.
3.
?
Torqueblade and Companionblade



 
« Last Edit: November 24, 2006, 07:28:25 PM by Robertlk808 » Logged

"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
ponytotts
Power User
***
Posts: 85


« Reply #28 on: November 25, 2006, 03:41:09 PM »

 :mrgreen:oooh, i like it!
does that last exercise looks a little rough on the lower back 2 anyone else?
Logged
ponytotts
Power User
***
Posts: 85


« Reply #29 on: November 26, 2006, 05:17:51 PM »

 shocked just looked @ the price! damn! in euro its not so bad, but dollars! wow!
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #30 on: December 18, 2006, 08:49:04 PM »

Woof All:

Torqueblade has kindly provided me with a pair for their research (and mine grin ). 

I have begun to play with them.  VERY interesting.

TAC,
CD
Logged
Dog Robertlk808
Power User
***
Posts: 544


« Reply #31 on: December 19, 2006, 01:42:52 PM »

Sweeeet!  Please post your findings.
Logged

"You see, it's not the blood you spill that gets you what you want, it's the blood you share. Your family, your friendships, your community, these are the most valuable things a man can have." Before Dishonor - Hatebreed
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #32 on: April 25, 2007, 11:27:59 AM »

Woof All:

We are in conversation with Torqueblades (Mike) about how to get the price down so that we can carry these here in our catalog. 

yip!
CD
Logged
ponytotts
Power User
***
Posts: 85


« Reply #33 on: April 25, 2007, 05:57:31 PM »

 cool
Logged
Bandolero
Power User
***
Posts: 108


« Reply #34 on: April 27, 2007, 04:43:08 PM »

The benefit I see to Torquebaldes over Clubbells for combatives training is that having an edged "blade" requires your slashes to be more precise in order to achieve the angle necessary to get the most effective cut.  You have that visual reference that is lacking with sticks, pipes, etc.

That being said, I have handled the Torqueblades and do not think they are anywhere as physically demanding as Clubbells are.  So if you are doing this type of conditioning to enhance your overall striking power and conditioning, I would go with Clubbells.  Tom's comment below about Clubbells is one I agree wholeheartedly with:

Quote
You can use dumbbells and wiffle ball bats full of cement, but once you use the real thing,...it is hard to switch.


Logged

"This is a war, and we are soldiers. Death can come for us at any time, in any place." ~ Morpheus
The Tao
Guest
« Reply #35 on: December 08, 2010, 07:29:30 PM »

I think some of you might find this unique training tool pretty neat.

http://www.torqueblade.com/home? ?<--- Check out the link to see them in action.


Torqueblade and Companionblade



 


Sweet! I can't wait to try these things out.
Logged
PPagan
Newbie
*
Posts: 5


« Reply #36 on: December 08, 2010, 07:52:48 PM »

Bark All,
I'm the new guy on the block at the moment, so I don't have all the dialect down embarassed

Colonel Ryabko of Systema has a good one that really works the front chain, and so is a great complement for KB work:

Set your feet 2-3 ft apart
Grab a staff at the top, set the bottom firmly on the ground about 5-6 ft in front of you (or in the angle between wall and floor--you don't want it slipping).
Lean forward supporting your weight with both hands gripping the staff.
DON'T let your low back arch--keep your torso in a slight forward "C" curve.
Keep you abdomen strongly pulled in (engage tranverse abdominal muscles).
Walk your hands slowly down the stick and back up.
Many variations possible.

Ryabko demonstrates many interesting stick tricks in his stickfighting DVD.

Yap yap (still can't get the pronounciation...)
Peter the Pagan
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #37 on: May 28, 2012, 02:21:43 PM »

Had to pick a thread and this is it.

Where do you guys come down on strength and strength training, as it relates to fighting with the stick.  I mean your garden variety 400lb DL, 300+ lb squat, etc sort of thing.  I am sure some of the fighters are very strong.  Are they able to bring it to bear, in their fights?  Is stick speed and striking strenght affected by strength or is this another thing, entirely.  I am thinking about this just because I need to pick up heavy things, at work and have benefitted from the standard compound lift training.  Will that benefit the fighter as well.

(I'll move this, if needed.  Just trying to avoid creating another thread.)
Logged
Mongolian Dog
Newbie
*
Posts: 32


« Reply #38 on: May 31, 2012, 06:44:49 PM »

Where do you guys come down on strength and strength training, as it relates to fighting with the stick.  I mean your garden variety 400lb DL, 300+ lb squat, etc sort of thing.  I am sure some of the fighters are very strong.  Are they able to bring it to bear, in their fights?  Is stick speed and striking strenght affected by strength or is this another thing, entirely.  I am thinking about this just because I need to pick up heavy things, at work and have benefitted from the standard compound lift training.  Will that benefit the fighter as well.

Common sense dictates that, all else equal, greater strength and power will be helpful in a full-contact encounter.

Mongolian Dog
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #39 on: June 01, 2012, 09:58:27 AM »

OTOH back when Eric and I went to the gym together I could handle bigger weights than him, but he hit A LOT harder.
Logged
dreatx
Newbie
*
Posts: 42


« Reply #40 on: June 01, 2012, 11:39:31 AM »

That OTOH.  How is that?  Is it not always possible to bring the strength from weight training into the power of your hits?  I have the power DVD and that is the total basis of my work on swinging hard. 

(I know there are other parts of the fight, like the ground and the clinch, too).
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #41 on: June 01, 2012, 12:30:51 PM »

If I knew the answer to that I'd be hitting harder than Eric  grin
Logged
bigdog
Power User
***
Posts: 2165


« Reply #42 on: June 01, 2012, 02:34:36 PM »

"Is it not always possible to bring the strength from weight training into the power of your hits?"

Body mechanics may be one answer.  If your shoulders are stronger than mine, then you should be able to swing a stick harder from the shoulder.  But if I successfully engage my feet, legs, core, shoulder and biceps (for example) to swing chances are very good that I can hit harder than you.  You might take a look at Bruce Lee's writings on the subject of striking. 

Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #43 on: June 01, 2012, 03:32:45 PM »

Well Duh grin
Logged
bigdog
Power User
***
Posts: 2165


« Reply #44 on: June 01, 2012, 07:01:56 PM »

My response wasn't really for you, Guro.  You understand body mechanics much better than do I. 
Logged
Mick C.
Newbie
*
Posts: 29


« Reply #45 on: June 01, 2012, 08:26:08 PM »

My rotator cuffs are feeling the strain lately - way too much popping and grinding and pain. I'm taking some time off lifting and training  to see if things mend, then will incorporate some of the training methods on this thread to gradually strengthen them. Thanks, everyone.
Logged
bigdog
Power User
***
Posts: 2165


« Reply #46 on: June 01, 2012, 09:12:26 PM »

Good luck, Mick!
Logged
Crafty_Dog
Administrator
Power User
*****
Posts: 31253


« Reply #47 on: June 01, 2012, 09:56:52 PM »

Mick:

Some things to consider:

In my experience, which may or may not apply to you, many people tend to have their shoulders somewhat internally rotated.  If when you stand without thinking your thumbs point inward instead of forward (i.e. parallel to each other) then to some degree probably there is internal rotation of the shoulder joint.  This then means that the joint tends to become annoyed by use.  Rest will allow the inflammation to settle down, but if the alignment issue has not been dealt with, then returning to working out will tend to annoy it all over again.

Why does the shoulder joint get internally rotated?

Typically because the hips are tilted forwards.

Why do the hips tilt forwards?

Typically because the hip flexors are tight and the muscles complementary to them (glute and one of the heads of the hamstring) have lost the ability to execute peak contraction movements well.

There is more to this analytical framework, but perhaps those thoughts may serve to help you find the cause and solution of your particular issues.
« Last Edit: June 02, 2012, 11:37:06 AM by Crafty_Dog » Logged
BeantownBeerBaron
Newbie
*
Posts: 3


« Reply #48 on: June 02, 2012, 10:47:26 AM »

Funny, my Kettlebell instructor said the exact same thing about my shoulders.  Took a couple of hours of private lessons to learn the details of how to do the basic two-handed swing, one-arm swing, and turkish get-ups.  Those 3 I to do after each workout to keep my shoulders and spine in proper alignment.

Turkish Get Ups for Shoulder/T-Spine
Swings for Core/Lower Back and executing those peak contraction movements Guro was referring to. 




Logged
JDN
Power User
***
Posts: 2004


« Reply #49 on: June 02, 2012, 02:04:44 PM »

Mick:

Some things to consider:

In my experience, which may or may not apply to you, many people tend to have their shoulders somewhat internally rotated.  If when you stand without thinking your thumbs point inward instead of forward (i.e. parallel to each other) then to some degree probably there is internal rotation of the shoulder joint.  This then means that the joint tends to become annoyed by use.  Rest will allow the inflammation to settle down, but if the alignment issue has not been dealt with, then returning to working out will tend to annoy it all over again.

Why does the shoulder joint get internally rotated?

Typically because the hips are tilted forwards.

Why do the hips tilt forwards?

Typically because the hip flexors are tight and the muscles complementary to them (glute and one of the heads of the hamstring) have lost the ability to execute peak contraction movements well.

There is more to this analytical framework, but perhaps those thoughts may serve to help you find the cause and solution of your particular issues.


That makes excellent sense.  If I recollect, you mentioned that you focused a lot on alignment.  Do you have any particular exercises or books on the subject that you
recommend?

Logged
Pages: [1] 2 Print 
« previous next »
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2013, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!