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Author Topic: The Politics of Health Care  (Read 328590 times)
Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1500 on: December 17, 2016, 01:29:15 PM »

An interesting articulation of the problem.  I will need to think more on this:

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ccp
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« Reply #1501 on: January 04, 2017, 07:05:31 AM »

We all want world class health care.  And at the same time we want someone else to pay for it.

There appears no way to get around the fact that to pay for pre existing conditions all of us will have to pay.  Hence reason for the "mandate"

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/443502/republicans-obamacare-repeal-plan-preexisting-coverage-problem
« Last Edit: January 04, 2017, 10:36:29 AM by Crafty_Dog » Logged
Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1502 on: January 04, 2017, 10:36:01 AM »

Good article.

The final paragraphs get to what I have been saying here for a very long time.  Prices need to be knowable.

I would like to explore the notion that prices need to be the same for everyone, be they insured or uninsured.

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G M
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« Reply #1503 on: January 04, 2017, 03:50:02 PM »

Good article.

The final paragraphs get to what I have been saying here for a very long time.  Prices need to be knowable.

I would like to explore the notion that prices need to be the same for everyone, be they insured or uninsured.



If I as the seller of a good or service decide to set the price differently for different customers, who is to tell me otherwise?

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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1504 on: January 04, 2017, 09:11:26 PM »

A fair question, but let me bounce it back at you:

As a customer, how would you feel if the supermarket charged you more for a given food item than someone else?
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1505 on: January 04, 2017, 09:24:08 PM »

How To Repeal ObamaCare
By DICK MORRIS
Published on DickMorris.com on January 4, 2017
A recent column by Heather R. Higgins and Phil Kerpen really points the way to how to get rid of this obnoxious program.  Their ideas are similar to ones I have ventured in this space.

Zero fund the fines for failure to buy insurance or offer it to one's workers.  No need to repeal it which would take 60 votes.  Just zero out the penalty and leave the "fine" on the books to rot away.  Zero fund the fines that penalize people for buying healthcare plans that are not as extensive or expensive as the bureaucrats want.  Let folks buy what they want -- or nothing at all -- and let them keep, or revert if they can, to their old policies.  Any state approved plan should be OK under ObamaCare.

Keep the subsidies in place but with less coverage and lower premiums, the subsidies will drop.

Keep coverage of pre-existing conditions and the prohibition against terminating a plan or raising premiums if people become ill.

And then bring under Medicare -- or some other government subsidy -- everyone whose illness is so bad and chronic that they can't meet their needs through insurance.

But Higgins and Kerpen add a new wrinkle -- they ask that Trump rescind the Obama Administration ruling exempting members of Congress and their staffs from ObamaCare requirements.  In practice, this means cutting their premium subsidies that currently pay for up to three-quarters of the cost.  As Higgins and Kerpen point out, "there is nothing as motivating as skin in the game."  By making members and staffers on Capitol Hill pay for more of their insurance, you can bet a sharp reduction of cost will be soon coming.

Republicans can only pass bills that come under the reconciliation procedure that only requires a simple majority in the Senate.  The parliamentarian decides what is kosher for reconciliation and what is an overreach.  But Republicans should feel free to override the parliamentarian's orders if they need to do so.

Don't let the Republicans sell the idea that a full repeal has to wait for years while a meaningless resolution signaling an intention to repeal takes effect.  This dodge and evasion would leave millions of people with plans they can't afford or deductibles that bar access to services. 

By a combination of executive orders and legislation that would not require 60 votes (because it is passed under reconciliation), get rid of this law now!
 
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G M
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« Reply #1506 on: January 04, 2017, 10:17:07 PM »

A fair question, but let me bounce it back at you:

As a customer, how would you feel if the supermarket charged you more for a given food item than someone else?


Can I go to another supermarket?
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1507 on: January 04, 2017, 11:57:06 PM »

In this case of health care, thanks to government meddling no you can't.
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DougMacG
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« Reply #1508 on: January 05, 2017, 01:11:49 AM »

GM:  If I as the seller of a good or service decide to set the price differently for different customers, who is to tell me otherwise?


I believe the criteria for determining legal discrimination is 'rational basis'.  

If the provider can collect sooner or with greater certainty, say with cash or guaranteed payment, the price might be lower.  There still can be prices published, easy to access that can also list available discounts and surcharges.

Yesterday I had the vocation of 'medical coding' explained to me.  CCP likely knows more.  The medical coder goes through the doctor's notes and writes down the codes and from that the computer bills it out - based on the doctor's handwriting!

If the computer knows the codes and all the rates, why can't the consumer?
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

CCP:
We all want world class health care.  And at the same time we want someone else to pay for it.
There appears no way to get around the fact that to pay for pre existing conditions all of us will have to pay.  Hence reason for the "mandate".



This question seems to be stumping everyone.  It seems to me that to qualify for the pre-existing conditions benefit you have to do a few things, sign up for coverage, pay extra, keep coverage as long as you have income, etc.  If it is subsidized, that subsidy should come out of general revenues and not drive up the rates for others making healthcare costs further out of reach for more and more people.

The federal budget already spends 1 trillion a year on healthcare.  We don't need to instantly or ever hit a zero number.  We can subsidize some healthcare and some people will still get healthcare for free.  The point of reform is to get more and more people, hundreds of millions of them, to be choosing and paying for their own private sector healthcare and for the government to be paying for less and less of it, at least as a proportion of the economy.  Within that privatization movement, the government can require better and better disclosure on services and prices, IMHO.
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1509 on: January 05, 2017, 08:21:53 AM »

How do we answer the charts and attendant assertions herein?

http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-hiltzik-obamacare-charts-20170104-story.html
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DougMacG
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« Reply #1510 on: January 05, 2017, 11:50:05 AM »

How do we answer the charts and attendant assertions herein?

http://www.latimes.com/business/hiltzik/la-fi-hiltzik-obamacare-charts-20170104-story.html

Good question and we can add to this with data but the simple answer is that the piece is deceptive by its omissions.  For example my plan was lost due to Obamacare.  I am switching doctors a second and third time due to Obamacare.  My cost has roughly doubled each year due to Obamacare.  The plan I choose to be on is illegal due to Obamacare.  I went from self-sufficient to subsidized due to Obamacare.  I am a ward of the state and disgusted by the thought of it.  (Yet I pay more than 100% of my take home income in taxes.)  Government subsidized healthcare is a concern and an extremely high marginal tax rate that faces each low to mid-income worker wishing to increase their income.  In other words, it keeps poor people poor, cripples the growth in the economy, and Democrats love that? Converting to subsidy is not lowering the cost.  On their charts I count as 'insured' and presumably satisfied with Obamacare - because I signed up for a lousy policy that has paid none of my actual expenses as opposed to breaking the law and paying penalties in addition to the cost of self-paid, over-priced healthcare.  

The last article published in Harrisburg (the political center of) Pennsylvania on healthcare before the election was that premiums are going up another 33% per year, in addition to all the other increases we had while Obama and Democrats were losing the House, Senate, state Houses and Governorships largely due to government over-reach and Obamacare.  Republicans hadn't carried PA (or MI or WI) in a Presidential election since Reagan's 49 state win in 1984.  Trump carried Pennsylvania by a greater margin, 67,000 votes, than Hillary had in NH, MN, NV and ME.  And it wasn't because of his high approvals!  People hate Obamacare and all it symbolizes in our government-run lives.  Club for Growth Republican Pat Toomey won reelection in (formerly) blue PA, by a wider margin than Trump.  Conservative Marco Rubio won Florida by eight times the margin of Trump, a combined margin of well over 2 million in a swing state over the nearest Democrat in 2 races since Obamacare.  Democrats lost 90% of their Presidential margin in MN in 8 years from 2008 to 2016.

The insurance companies failed and are pulling out of states and markets.  The risk corridors failed.  People are given fewer and fewer choices, less competition.  The system is broken.  It was broken before Obamacare.  Obamacare was sold on lies, rammed down our throats and made things worse.  If the charts don't show that, it's time for new and better charts.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2017, 12:04:20 PM by DougMacG » Logged
G M
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« Reply #1511 on: January 05, 2017, 12:04:26 PM »

I stopped paying for health insurance and broke out my Tribal ID card and went to the local tribal health clinic. The prescription I used to pay 30 bucks a month for now costs one dollar.

Indians are exempted from Obamacare!
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Crafty_Dog
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« Reply #1512 on: January 05, 2017, 01:48:33 PM »

This is POTH, but it makes clear the wisdom of Trump's tweets of yesterday about making sure the Dems own the disaster.  At the moment it looks like the Reps are about to step in to take the blame.  Stupid party once again?

http://www.nytimes.com/2017/01/04/us/affordable-care-act-congress-repeal-plan.html?emc=edit_th_20170105&nl=todaysheadlines&nlid=49641193
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ccp
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« Reply #1513 on: January 13, 2017, 07:54:21 AM »

I get this stuff in the mail and while I agree health care has needed changes I don't agree with the government taking over all of it which the ACA was to be the first step in that direction:

https://www.acponline.org/advocacy/acp-advocate/issue/article/718592
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ccp
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« Reply #1514 on: January 16, 2017, 09:07:10 AM »

Just as liberal as the rest of academia.   In medical journals , other non medical magazines, Smithsonian, National Geographic they are all being overwhelmed with agenda driven liberals.   I quit my NEJM subscription some years ago for this reason.  Any moe Nat Geo stuff like last months ( *cover to cover* - not an article of even 2 but the entire magainze in my face diatribe on LBGTQ and 40 other letters) and that will be cancelled as well. 

http://www.nationalreview.com/article/443876/public-health-crisis-gun-violence-debunked
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ccp
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« Reply #1515 on: January 17, 2017, 09:27:16 AM »

But this is probably right:
https://www.conservativereview.com/commentary/2017/01/gop-plan-to-dupe-members-into-keeping-obamacare/
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