Show Posts

This section allows you to view all posts made by this member. Note that you can only see posts made in areas you currently have access to.

Messages - Mongolian Dog

Pages: [1]
I like the idea of a forum where you can simply just enter, it totally nullifies much of the BS our martial arts.

This is very true, and I think it is important.  It reinforces the core idea of minimal structure, and 'one rule only'.  That one rule is so important, and so enabling (in terms of providing the space and freedom to explore the rest without constraint) that I would hate to see it diluted -- even for good logistical reasons.  Consider this too: as it stands, naysayers can be offered an invitation, "Just show up and see for yourself."  If qualifying events are required, then that is lost.  The same mechanism that might serve to guard 'minimum standards' could also function as a kind of shield which could ironically soften the venue over time.

Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: 9/23/12 Dog Brothers Open Gathering of the Pack
« on: September 25, 2012, 04:56:44 PM »
Even though I am no longer an active fighter, a Gathering still puts me in the altered space in the following days.  It is a space and a vibration I hold onto as best as I can for as long as I can.

. . .

When I was done I sat for a time looking out over the kelp beds and out into the vastness of the ocean and went silent.


Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: 9/23/12 Dog Brothers Open Gathering of the Pack
« on: September 08, 2012, 05:57:55 PM »
looking for a knife fight to fill out my card. so far doing double and stick/knife with a dog and a full brother. feeling it already!!! chatter!!!

I could take a knife fight if you like.

Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: Condtioning for the stick
« on: May 31, 2012, 04:44:49 PM »
Where do you guys come down on strength and strength training, as it relates to fighting with the stick.  I mean your garden variety 400lb DL, 300+ lb squat, etc sort of thing.  I am sure some of the fighters are very strong.  Are they able to bring it to bear, in their fights?  Is stick speed and striking strenght affected by strength or is this another thing, entirely.  I am thinking about this just because I need to pick up heavy things, at work and have benefitted from the standard compound lift training.  Will that benefit the fighter as well.

Common sense dictates that, all else equal, greater strength and power will be helpful in a full-contact encounter.

Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: Large trainer puncture
« on: May 29, 2012, 09:59:03 AM »

Martial Arts Topics / Re: Suitable Knives for DB Gathering Fights
« on: May 24, 2012, 12:08:29 PM »
Mongolian Dog, I gathered up the blades but I haven't found the unmodified Edges2 short blade.  I hope to post pix during the long weekend.  Since I've seen a number of burred blades at Gatherings and martial arts training seminars, I wouldn't be surprised if your gash was from a blade with a burr on the tip.

Thanks, I look forward to all the pictures.

As far as my gash goes, there might have been a burr, but I didn't notice anything when I inspected it.  That said, I was less focused on the issue then than I would be now -- and might have missed it.

- Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: Suitable Knives for DB Gathering Fights
« on: May 23, 2012, 04:28:21 PM »
Quite a treatise, Mongolian Dog.

Yeah, sorry about that.  I have just been thinking all this through and would rather talk it out than end up on either end of a mistake -- having just had a close call.  I think the idea of an extra-blunt modfiied tip might make sense even despite the aesthetic problem, if it makes it significantly harder to puncture someone.  Do you have any good pictures of those?

Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: Suitable Knives for DB Gathering Fights
« on: May 23, 2012, 02:45:23 PM »
At past Gatherings, I brought two aluminum blades:  one for myself, one for my opponent.  The primary reason was that i didn't want to be stuck or cut with one of those diamond-shaped kung Fu blades with the nastiest burrs, even on the tip.  The secondary reason is that I didn't want my opponent to use a plastic blade.  Since this event is largely propagated with pictures (video clips are great, but they seem to have inadequate circulation until very recently), I don't think it's a good idea to showcase the world's premiere weapons fighting event with plastic implements of destruction.

I should probably chime in here.  Ironically, I used to use one of those small Nok knives -- the black foam ones with hard plastic inside.  I liked that it's very hard to hurt someone with them, but it seems that the very harmlessness of the device may be a liability -- both in terms of immediate effect and of perception, as you note.  I remember right after you and I fought in the Fall that Guro Crafty said, "Next time consider an aluminum knife: it's easier to see."  (Or words to that effect, I apologize for any misquotation.)  I realize now that I inadvertently created just the situation you strive to avoid; and I apologize for that.

In any case, our fight did get me thinking about the desirability of the large aluminum trainers; and I ordered one.  (Thanks to Bob Burgee -- who rushed me a replacement days before the Tribal when the original was lost in transit.)  When I fought Beowful, we inspected one another's weapons (it was a knife fight), and he had a comparable aluminum trainer.  Long story short, we both took some damage as a result of engaging in a fairly close, aggressive way.  This was something I did on purpose because I was interested in understanding the engagement parameters better.  The point of this story is that I took one stab to the armpit which did, in fact, puncture me fairly well.  (It was a good, clean stab -- thank you, Beowulf.)  And in return, I delivered a pretty hard thrust to his ribs around his heart.  Fortunately, we're both fine.  I needed four stitches, and decided to avoid grappling or clinching contact for the rest of the day.  Beowulf thought at one point he might have cracked his ribs but tells me now it's just muscular bruising.  That's good news.

The important point I want to make is that above and beyond anything else, I think the main factor in what can be responsibly used is going to be the people involved -- and the ability to find the line within the code, 'friends at the end of the day'.  I am still new to these rules of engagement and have only had a few knife fights, so I am hardly an expert.  The question is what level of restraint is implied by using the aluminum trainers.  I feel confident that a relatively 'sporting' style of engagement can work with the trainers.  In that case, both parties work to control distance in such a way that any cuts/thrusts are relatively controlled.  I think that style of what Guro Crafty calls 'sport knife dueling' works well with the aluminum.

What I'm not sure about is what happens if one or both parties wants to change the mindset to simulate something different, more primal.  Well, yes, I am sure: I think there's an injury risk which *might* be too great.  I brought the new knife in order to explore that boundary and with the intention of trying to understand how more 'realistic' contact could be used to sharpen things further.  It all worked out well, but I did find what is -- for me -- the edge from which I would want to back down.  I'm really glad I *didn't* crack Beowulf's rib, or worse.  And I'm really glad his thrust didn't go just a little deeper, or hit in a slightly different spot.  We were lucky, but I believe some of the 'luck' was that even while increasing the pressure and intensity -- there was no intent to harm: it was still a 'conversation' between friends.

I'm not sure yet what this means for the choices I will make in the future.  I think it means I won't try to replicate that situation in quite the same way.  I think maybe it means that in addition to agreeing on weapons, perhaps I need to engage in more specific discussion and negotiation of the parameters implied by the weapons chosen.  Perhaps this discussion can catalyze a more general discussion of *that* topic.  For example, later that day Gong Fu and I had spear vs sword fight -- in which we agreed to respect the point of his staff as a speartip, and the edge of my wooden bokken as a blade.  Even though it was *not* 'harder' contact, I felt that it did promote 'higher consciousness' within the context of what a Gathering represents.

I still want to explore the more aggressive ranges of the knife.  It is something I do not understand well enough yet.  But maybe for that to work it will be necessary to agree to work with the safer foam-covered knives.  By the same token, given that the 'hidden knife' is generally used as a weapon of last resort to combat clinching or grappling, I am not sure whether it's realistically possible to expect to engage in that situation accurately even with the thick aluminum trainers.  There's something valuable about the ambiguity, but the ambiguity also creates danger because there's not a commonly agreed upon meaning to the presence of the knife.  We don't want to engage in a point-sparring or rules-controlled mentality, but maybe we need more specific agreement about what each weapon 'means' in any given fight.

This is getting long, so I will end here.  I don't know the right answer but thought my experience of the situation seemed relevant in terms of focusing some of the many complex issues I see involved here.  Beause this is all still quite new to me, I am thinking it through for the first time.  Even if the answers that would clear up my confusion are already well-known, it might be useful to discuss them again.  That might help the 'wisdom of the tribe' to expand into greater specificity in terms of how the knife can be used productively and *somewhat* safely.

Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: DBMA Tribal Gathering: May 19-20
« on: May 21, 2012, 03:39:22 PM »
Congratulations to both of you, I notice there no longer appears a C- before your names  :-)

Thank you very much indeed, sir.

- Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: DBMA Tribal Gathering: May 19-20
« on: May 20, 2012, 06:58:54 PM »

A fantastic weekend and great day.  Sincere thanks to all my opponents and to the assembled tribe.  This event will live in my memory.

- Mongolian Dog

Dog Rick, here's the answer, paraphrased:

It's called axon testing.  It tests the same cognitive domains as impact testing but is shorter and simpler. 'It is basically computerized neuropsychological testing.'


Thanks for the input and info, Dog Rick.

Any chance you could find out which tool he is using? Two more common ones are the SCUT and the MACE (I don't remember what they stand for) and I know there are others.

I wrote to ask and will update with a response when I have one.


[Admin: I'm not 100% sure if this is the right place to post this.  It's certainly related to the topic but is also somewhat circumstantial.  If it belongs elsewhere, please feel free to move it.]

The neurologist who screens boxers and MMA fighters for the state (California) happens to be a family friend and my parents' neighbor.  I bumped into him the other day, and we got to talking about head trauma, etc.  Basically the topic of this thread, so I won't belabor it.  He confirmed that the more they learn about the long-term effects of repeated concussions (or perhaps as or more worrisome, multiple sub-concussive blows), the worse it looks.

He also mentioned that he's putting together a study of boxers and MMA fighters, which he is hoping the state will sponsor.  That hasn't come through yet, but the testing might still be of interest to those who fight in the Gatherings.  The general idea is to get periodic neurological screening to establish a baseline.  He didn't go into detail about the test they use, but he said it involves a deck of cards -- since that's easy to understand and crosses language/cultural barriers.  Apparently the results are quite stable over a long time frame in the absence of trauma.  With a baseline in place, it becomes possible to notice whether things are getting worse.  Or if an acute trauma occurs (say you take a hard shot and feel woozy), you can get tested again and have a quantitative sense of the effect.  The idea is that you'd refrain from further contact until you (hopefully) tested 'normal' according to your established baseline again.  This is all just from memory, so I may have gotten some details wrong, but hopefully you get the general idea.

As we talked about all this, I realized this is probably important.  It's something I want to do for myself.  I won't wax too personal in this post, but Guro Crafty recently made a post elsewhere discussing the issue of 'how much is enough'?  That helped focus my thinking about the whole topic.  I think everyone who fights at the Gatherings understands the benefits, and one thing I really appreciate is that we have a thread like this which helps us to understand what the costs may be.  Participating with open eyes is, I think, an important part of getting the most out of what can be a highly transformative experience.  It's part of what separates an event like the Gathering from random brawling . . .

In the three years I have fought so far, there has always been at least one person who takes a hard shot.  The fact is, the possibility of hard head shots is an irreducible part of what makes a Dog Brothers' encounter what it is.  It's the reality of that possibility which focuses the tactics and mindset required to participate.  When I described the headgear (fencing masks) to the doctor, his (neutral) response was, "That doesn't really provide much actual protection of the head (as opposed to the face), does it?"  And he has a point.

In any case, that was a longwinded introduction.  What I wanted to say is that the testing takes place at his office, which I believe is in San Pedro, on Tuesday and Friday afternoons.  The study hasn't been funded yet, so there's no subsidy for the cost, which is $85.  However, if a group of fighters wanted to be tested, he said they could do it 'a little cheaper'.  I don't know whether this is useful or interesting for anyone, but I thought I would throw it out there.  I plan to have the testing done before I fight again, and I told the doctor (I'm not including his name for privacy reasons) I would put out feelers to see if anyone else wanted to.  If nothing else, I think the reasoning I've laid out here is part of an important conversation fighters should be having (at least with themselves).

I have no personal stake in this.  I just thought a more quantitative diagnostic might be valuable for others wrestling with the question of 'how much is enough'?  I've gained so much through the opportunity the Gatherings present, and I want to see them continue with as few negative after-effects as possible -- so everyone involved can 'walk as a warrior for all of their days'.  Since this happened to come up and seemed so relevant, I thought I would pass it on, in case anyone else wants to participate.  If so, I guess PM me, and we can take it to email.

- c-Mongolian Dog

Martial Arts Topics / Re: DBMA Tribal Gathering: May 19-20
« on: January 20, 2012, 08:48:48 PM »
I'm hoping to make it.

Martial Arts Topics / Re: The Dog Brothers Tribe
« on: September 20, 2011, 07:36:44 PM »
Woof C-Mongolian Dog, jk...if I didn't give you a hard time, I don't like you. Only so many letters in the alphabet  :-D

Oh I know.  I almost said, "You'll have to fight me for it -- but then I realized you might take me up on it!"  Gotta watch my step with this crowd.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: The Dog Brothers Tribe
« on: September 20, 2011, 02:37:27 PM »
How does one actually spelled that on computer...

If you don't have a Mac, you'd have to resort to some madness with the alt key and character codes -- hence Crafty's request for an adequate simplification (just omit the accents).

the other C-MD...stole my initials...  :wink:



Martial Arts Topics / Re: The Dog Brothers Tribe
« on: September 20, 2011, 02:01:03 PM »
For those of use without keyboards that do such things, how should that be written without accents, dots over letters, and such.   Does Chhimed Kunzang work for you?

Yes, that's fine.  Or -- with the apostrophe but without the accents might be the best compromise: Chhi'med Kunzang.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: The Dog Brothers Tribe
« on: September 20, 2011, 01:12:09 PM »
C-"Mongolian Dog" Cchi Med Kintang

Woof and thanks!  Maybe this is the best place to provide a canonical spelling of my name.  It's otherwise indecipherable, and I know my handwriting on the registration forms probably doesn't help.  It's: Chhi'mèd Künzang.

- c-MD

Time to go down to the garage on keep working on that sweep.

I like the way you think, man.  Thanks for the fight: I enjoyed it.  Thanks also to Guro Crafty for hosting, and to my other opponents.  The opportunity to step out and engage like this and still remain 'friends at the end of the day' is quite something.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: Hermosa Clan
« on: August 25, 2011, 12:49:05 PM »
Off the top of my head for the Hermosa Clan:
followed by this,
Chi-med, , , ,

was nice to see!  Looking forward to it.


I'm planning to attend this year and figure it can't hurt to set up some fights in advance.  That's what I did the first time -- but just showed up and played it by ear last year.  Seems like a mixture is standard, so if anyone wants to pre-arrange, let me know.  I'm open to possibilities, mainly considering combinations of:

+ single stick
+ staff
+ knife / no-knife
+ grappling / no-grappling

In other words, a prearranged stick-with-grappling-but-no-knife would work -- as would other combinations of those parameters.  I'm also vaguely open to the idea of a mismatched/asymmetrical fight -- like staff vs stick.  Or even maybe stick vs no-stick or knife.  However, that's only a tentative idea, and I'm not sure how productive it would be given my experience level.  Maybe next year.  Likewise, I'm open to fighting those with or without experience, but I won't claim any refined ability to break a newbie in -- being only a tad more than a newbie myself.

- ck

I am still digging my way through the pile of emails accumulated in the last few weeks, but in case I screwed up, please resend it.


Forgive the moment of advertising, but  , , , ahem , , , there is training available in the Hermosa Beach area too  :-D

I know it, and you have an email from me buried in your pile.  Hermosa will actually be closer for me anyway, but it's still true that I'd like to work out with the NoHo crew sometimes.  Sorry for either being too diplomatic -- or not diplomatic enough; but I reckon it's all good.  In the fable, Country Mouse is scared 'back to from where he came' when he encounters the City Dogs.  Hopefully this Country Moose can avoid that fate.  Either way, it will be fun to run with or from the dogs!

- Dog CK

Hey brother, are you planning on training with NOHO? I would be great to have some new blood and fellow Dog to our group.

You know, the future is a big mystery right now -- especially with regard to what kind of training situations will shake out.  But no matter what I'm able to find the time to commit to regularly, I'm sure I'll come work out with you guys sometimes.  I had fun and learned a lot last time; and I'm sure I'd get a lot out of it.  Thanks for taking the time to show me what's what; I look forward to more of it in good time.

- Dog CK

I had initially hoped to be able to attend the tribal this year -- but I got embroiled in training for an MMA fight and then in preparing to move . . . to SoCal.  So chances of attending in the future just sky-rocketed.  Sounds like it was a great event.  Hats off to the fighters.  See you all in 3 . 2 . 1 .


Martial Arts Topics / Re: DB 9/10 Gg of Pack clip
« on: October 14, 2010, 09:22:54 AM »
It's marked as private, in case that helps.

Martial Arts Topics / Re: The Dog Brothers Tribe
« on: September 22, 2010, 05:15:01 PM »
As requested by Crafty, I'm posting here to mention my new 'Dog' prefix.  Very sorry to hear about your loss, Howie.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: Dog Brothers Open Gathering Sept 19, 2010
« on: September 21, 2010, 10:54:49 PM »
Thanks to everyone for a great experience -- my second Gathering.  In particular, thanks to everyone I fought: Peter, Ryan, Tim, Jeremiah, and Ryoga.  There were too many interesting moments from the day to enumerate them here, but I will say I appreciate the opportunity to participate in such an extraordinary event.  I enjoyed it immensely, especially the spirit of mutual encouragement making it possible for so many people to come together and build each other up in this way.  That requires a great deal of trust and a great deal of bravery, and I count myself lucky to have found a place where such exchange is possible.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: Dog Brothers Open Gathering Sept 19, 2010
« on: August 28, 2010, 02:48:29 PM »
I picked up a pair of Asics Split Second 7 wrestling shoes on sale.  They have two rubber areas on the sole, one is clear and the other is natural rubber color.  The salesman assured me they are non-marking.  At $50 these seem like pretty good quality, and I'm sure I will get future use out of them given that their mat-safe -- so no worries about the expense, etc.  If anyone else is thinking about ordering online, they seem to run narrow.  I got an 11, which I sometimes have to for width only -- and they still feel tight.  However, I'm also assured that they stretch out quickly.  Hopefully that information will be useful for someone.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: Dog Brothers Open Gathering Sept 19, 2010
« on: August 27, 2010, 11:11:45 AM »
[Note: I started (and deleted) a new thread with this topic because I confused this thread with the fighter registration thread -- which has been locked.  Sorry for any confusion.]

Can anyone point me to an example of a relatively inexpensive wrestling shoe whose sole definitely complies with the venue's requirements.  I've never bought wrestling shoes before, and I'm also unsure as to exactly how a 'white' sole would be specified -- and whether that is different from a normal 'non-black' sole, etc.  Basically, I'd like to wear shoes and don't want to spend a lot of money on it.  Suggestions?


Martial Arts Topics / Re: September 20, 2009 Gathering
« on: September 21, 2009, 11:41:44 AM »
I want to thank Crafty and all the Dog Brothers for making an event like this possible.  Also, thanks to Howie and Ryan -- the newbies fighting newbies; none of us knew quite what to expect, and it was nice that we could figure it out with each other.  I also appreciate the other Ryan asking me for the left-handed fight: it was good to get one more in, but I wouldn't have had the nerve to ask anyone more experienced.  The whole event had a great feeling of mutual benefit, and that made it easy to move past the nerves and dive in.  Altogether, a great experience for me.  Thanks again.


Martial Arts Topics / Re: September 20, 2009 Gathering
« on: August 28, 2009, 03:40:14 PM »
Hi all,

Marc/Crafty suggested I hit the forum, so I thought I'd make a quick intro with perhaps a few questions.

First off, I'm planning to attend the Gathering in September -- which is both exciting and daunting.  This will be uncharted territory for me, and I really appreciate that a venue like this exists.  I imagine it will be a challenge getting things dialed in at first, but hopefully I'll find appropriate matches.  If anyone fancies a fight with someone fairly green (maybe another newb -- or someone who just likes easy pickin's) I'll probably be a bit dazed and disoriented, so I'll extend my willingness to give it a shot here -- while I'm not quite so shy.

I probably have a number of tedious questions, but the only one that's leaping to mind now relates to footwear.  Are sneakers about the right caliber for this sort of thing?

I've met up with Marc a few times -- and watched some videos -- so I've got a general picture of what to expect; but I don't have a great sense for some of the tedious pragmatics like those.  So, if anyone can think back on their first time and wants to offer any advice -- of whatever kind, I'd be happy to hear it.  I'm looking forward to this -- not only for the 'realism' of it, but for the inspiring notion that this can be accomplished in a way that still leads to being 'friends at the end of the day'.  It will be good to make some new friends soon.


Pages: [1]