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Messages - Spadaccino

Pages: 1 [2]
51
Martial Arts Topics / Escape from Rome
« on: November 05, 2003, 12:45:54 PM »
Guro Crafty,

Ajarn Marco de Cesaris teaches that ancient style of Thai boxing, does he not (the kind with the cord-wrapped fists)?

I'd like to know more about it.

Peace,

Dave/TFS

52
Martial Arts Topics / Eskrimadors in Jean LaFitte's pirate force?
« on: November 05, 2003, 08:42:35 AM »
I've occasionally read that there were some Filipinos amongst the many nationalities in Jean LaFitte's band of pirates in New Orleans, and it has been claimed that they were eskrimadors.

Can anyone shed any more light on this?

Thanks,

TFS

53
Question Everything,

You picked an apt username.

Very interesting info.

Peace,

TFS

54
Hello All,

Great thread...

As usual I have come away knowing more than I did before--thanks to everyone, especially the always informative Sun_Helmet!

Peace,

Dave/TFS

55
Quote from: Guest
Quote from: Spadaccino
Quote from: Guest

Who cares what they call it and what terms are used?  The shit just works.  In fact, they can call it shit but if it works - it works.


-snip-

Then, when some folks question the switch to historically invalid terms like "kali", others simply blow it off by saying "who cares what it's called, as long as it works?"

Quote
Anything else discussed is pointless... unless you are spending more time being a history buff or hoplologist than training.  'Nuff said.


Ah yes, the ol' macho "we should only be training" bit.  What about folks who are both hoplologists AND serious martial artists--like the late founder of modern hoplology himself, Donn F. Draeger?  How do folks like him fit into your equation?

I'm sorry if any of the above offends anyone (it's honestly not meant to), but I've seen Guest's line of argument too many times in the past, and I'm a little weary of it.

Peace,

David Black Mastro/TFS


Rebuttal to the two points...

The terms don't really matter to me... really.  You can call it whatever you like including an ice cream sundae.  I guess people like to identify with something and be part of a collective.  No problem.  I can respect that.  I just do not place emphasis on it.

As for Don Draeger, I highly respect people like him and that research into such subjects.  The same can be said of John Gilby / Robert Smith.  There are many others who research into such topics of the fighting traditions of various cultures.  Some societies even preserve such knowledge and it never sees the light of day.  Intriguing to read and very provocative.  For me, if all that research does not produce, substantiate, or make revelation any lost knowledge for constructive use or application then it is spinning one's wheels.  But that is just me.

I guess my focus is in a different place but I respect anybody that goes with their passion.   Not my cup of tea, though.  At a certain point it does become pointless.  More power to those that can dig up truths for the rest of us.


Fair enough.

Peace,

David Black Mastro

56
Quote from: sheryn lascano
i'm a filipina.  and i've also spent considerable time in indonesia and malaysia.  there are more close similarities between these 3 countries, than they do differences.  it's been said that if you speak ilokano, bisaya, and tagalog, you'll survive pretty well in malaysia and indonesia, which is very true.  if the linguistics similarities are so close, then it's pretty safe to say that many other cultural similarities exists as well--i.e. martial arts.  mr. inosanto recognized this and has promoted the very similarities in the martial arts.


Hi Sheryn,

With all due respect to both Mr. Inosanto (the man is awesome--and my own teacher trained under him for some time) and you, how can you come to such a conclusion?  Similarities in linguistics are not necessarily synonymous with similiarities in martial arts.  

Besides, how would one then account for the fact that something like 60% of FMA terms are in Spanish?

I could show you umbrella blocks and snake disarms from 15th century German fechtbuchs, which predate any known European contact with the Philippines.  This doesn't mean that those techniques were "invented" in late Medieval or Renaissance Germany--it simply means that different martial peoples came up with similar solutions to similar problems, at different times.

Likewise, while I certainly don't feel that FMA came from Spanish fencing (and this is stressed by both Filipino martial artists in general, as well as modern classical fencing exponents, like Ramon Martinez), there are clearly some similarities with the two--how much of this overlap is actually due to a cross-cultural exchange, and how much is the result of "parallel evolution", is anybody's guess.  Ultimately it doesn't matter, but the relationship was not lost on several prominent FMA practitioners over the years.  Jose Rizal, in addition to being an arnisador, also studied Spanish esgrima, both in the Philippines at the Tanghalan ng Sandata, and in Spain.  More modern masters have noted similarities as well, such as Amante P. Marinas, who has written on this subject numerous times.

What this all boils down to is the truly unique position that the Philippine Islands occupy in the MA world--being that "martial arts crossroads".  Again, there are influences from many Asian martial arts, as well as some European ones, that are represented in FMA as a whole.  This doesn't make FMA any less "Filipino"--not one bit.

Respectfully,

David Black Mastro

57
Quote from: Guest

Who cares what they call it and what terms are used?  The shit just works.  In fact, they can call it shit but if it works - it works.


I think the problem is that many people in the FMA community have made various claims regarding terminology, etc.  They have changed over from common expressions like eskrima to things like "kali", presumably to give the art a more authentic Filipino "feel".  Why this is necessary is beyond me, since the PI are probably THE major "martial arts crossroads", where one can find, in addition to the native styles, influences from Indonesia, India, China, Japan, and Europe (mainly Spain, of course).  FMA terms are a mixture of many indigenous languages (Tagalog, Visayan, et al) and Spanish.  What's the big deal, and why bother to change over from established terms to something else?  The Filipino martial arts are truly unique in their composition--certainly, what other Asian styles can claim such a varied and interesting history and lineage?  This diversity is what makes FMA so versatile and effective, and that's a GOOD thing.

Then, when some folks question the switch to historically invalid terms like "kali", others simply blow it off by saying "who cares what it's called, as long as it works?"

Quote
Anything else discussed is pointless... unless you are spending more time being a history buff or hoplologist than training.  'Nuff said.


Ah yes, the ol' macho "we should only be training" bit.  What about folks who are both hoplologists AND serious martial artists--like the late founder of modern hoplology himself, Donn F. Draeger?  How do folks like him fit into your equation?

I'm sorry if any of the above offends anyone (it's honestly not meant to), but I've seen Guest's line of argument too many times in the past, and I'm a little weary of it.

Peace,

David Black Mastro/TFS

58
Interesting thread.

59
Martial Arts Topics / Guro Crafty/Spain Stabbing
« on: October 19, 2003, 08:24:51 PM »
Hello Rafael,

Quote from: rafael
ok so nobody realy anserd crafties questions sssssssoooooooo i will try to help


Hey, I did my best to explain the terms I knew, at least in their historical context.  I don't speak Spanish, so I'm still at a loss as to what the incident exactly involved.

Quote
1) Does "atracar" mean "atacar" or something else?
it means to rob or too mug to burgle.


OK.

Quote
2) What does "arrebatar" mean?
 it means to snatch or to take away.


Interesting how meanings change over time (or perhaps it's a matter of a different dialect?).  I figured since Guro Crafty didn't know the term, there might be some archaic association with it.  I therefore gave the one definition of the word that I am familiar with--a cut powered from the shoulder.

Quote
3) What does "propino'" mean? I would have guessed "tipped" as in "he tipped the waiter" (propina, propinar) but that does not seem very logical here  
"propino" it means to give to deal BUT  it has other meanigs depending on ti use
 
4) What does "arma blanca" mean? The literal "White weapon" does not seem to make much sense.
" arma blanca " can go frome small blades to stiks or others ( it realy means any thing other than fire weaponds )
hope to have healped


I think that I at least defined this one just fine. :)

Peace,

David Black Mastro

60
Martial Arts Topics / Guro Crafty/Spain Stabbing
« on: October 19, 2003, 08:18:17 PM »
Forgot to login yet again...  :lol:

61
Martial Arts Topics / Guro Crafty/Spain Stabbing
« on: October 19, 2003, 01:54:29 PM »
Quote from: yojimbo
hi spadaccino,

i was hoping you could help me out on some linguistics here...

what exactly does arnis or arnes mean in spanish, french or italian?

eskrime or esgrime is fencer in spanish and french, correct?

for arnis, i've gotten "chain mail", "chain", "weaving" from different sources, but no one really knows what exactly arnis or arnes is.  hoping you can clear some things up.

thanks!


Hello Yojimbo, Erica, & Dog Carlo,

Arnis is a corruption of the Spanish word arnes, which, as Dog Carlo already pointed out, means "harness".  In the Medieval and Renaissance European context, "harness" means armor (for example, in the German knightly tradition, fighting in armor was known as Harnisch Fechten).

The expression arnes de mano ("armor of the hands") referred to the costumes that were worn by Filipino actors in the komedya plays that were performed for the Spanish.  The actors apparently incorporated martial arts moves into their repertoire, thereby helping to preserve FMA during the repressive Spanish rule.  Arnes de mano was coined around 1853, and, soon after, the term was shortened simply to arnis, which is how the Spanish word arnes was assimilated into the Tagalog lanuage.

Esgrima is the Spanish term for "fencing".  A fencer is therefore an esgrimador.

In Italian, fencing is known as scherma, whereas a fencer is a schermitore.  (BTW, spadaccino means "swordsman" :)).

In French, the term for fencing is escrime, while a fencer is known as an escrimeur.

In German, the term for fencing is fechten, and a fencer is a fechter.

As far as I can tell, the Spanish first used the term esgrima to describe FMA sometime in the 1700s.  Esgrima, in turn, became corrupted to escrima, when it was assimilated into the Tagalog language.  Nowadays, it has become increasingly common to see escrima spelled as eskrima.

If anyone has any other questions regarding anything above, let me know, and I'll do my best to answer them.

Peace,

David Black Mastro

P.S.  Yojimbo is a great movie!

62
Martial Arts Topics / The use of the [i]bilbo[/i]-style sword in FMA?
« on: October 14, 2003, 06:44:07 AM »
OK that's better.

Anyway, this type of weapon would really fit the bill for larga mano work--I'm curious as to how many may still be out there...

(Guro Crafty--feel free to eliminate that first lame attempt at my post)

63
Martial Arts Topics / Use of bilbo-style sword in FMA?
« on: October 14, 2003, 06:42:01 AM »
Damn, forgot to login AGAIN...

During the Seven Years' War, the Brits invaded the Philippines.  One British officer commented on the weaponry used by the Filipino levies in Spanish service--he noted the long, double-edged swords they were issued by the Spanish.  He also commented on the "retro" design of the hilts--they were cup-hilts (keep in mind that this was in the mid-1700s, when such a sword design was not seen elsewhere).

These swords were not the familiar cup-hilt rapiers, but broad-bladed, cut-and-thrust bilbos, which were named after the town of Bilbao (presumably were they were first made).

The Spanish 1796 cavalry sword below is fairly representative of what a bilbo would have looked like:



(Taken from Juan Jose Perez's very interesting Spanish sword site)
http://bermudas.ls.fi.upm.es/~pedro/tropacab_e.htm

FMA books occasionally allude to how Spanish weapons were sometimes employed in the various FMA styles, especially by the mestizos who may have had experience both in the indigenous methods and Spanish esgrima.  Do any such swords survive in Filipino museums?

Thanks,

David/TFS

64
Martial Arts Topics / Tapered sticks in LSA?
« on: October 12, 2003, 12:10:00 PM »
Very interesting--thank you.

65
Martial Arts Topics / Tapered sticks in LSA?
« on: October 12, 2003, 07:07:20 AM »
Thanks for the input, folks.

So, we have examples of this type of tapered stick in both hardwoods (like kamagong) and rattan--interesting.

What about the wrapping on the handle, it that common?  What materials are used?  Leather?  Cord?  Athletic Tape?

Thanks,

Dave/TFS

66
Martial Arts Topics / Tapered sticks in LSA?
« on: October 11, 2003, 04:46:21 AM »
Hello Everyone,

I've often seen photos of GM Benjamin Luna Lema, of Lightning Scientific Arnis, using a stick that appears to be tapered, and with the grip wrapped in some material.  I found this interesting, as it would make the stick in question balance and therefore handle more like a sword.  Does anyone have any info on this or any other tapered sticks used in FMA?

Thanks,

Dave/TFS

67
Martial Arts Topics / Guro Crafty/Spain Stabbing
« on: October 10, 2003, 07:12:01 PM »
Quote from: Enganyo
That's more Spanish than I know. :)

Thank you.
Smoke/Enganyo


Anytime, bro!

Peace,

Dave/TFS

68
Martial Arts Topics / Guro Crafty/Spain Stabbing
« on: October 10, 2003, 05:00:42 AM »
Did someone call for me? :D

I'll define the terms that I'm familiar with...

What does "arma blanca" mean? The literal "White weapon" does not seem to make much sense.

arma blanca: "white arm" or "white weapon".

"White arm" is a traditional European expression for "sword".   More broadly, it can apply to other edged hand weapons, but it most often refers to the sword.  One can find this expression in Italian (arma bianco), French (arme blanche), etc.  It appears to be a reference to the "brave" or "noble" character of close-combat weapons, as opposed to the "cowardly" associations of missile weapons (ie., consider the contempt that knights had for archers and gunners).

This sort of prejudice continued even into the Renaissance, where musketeers and arquebusiers were known collectively as "shot", whereas pikemen, halberdiers, and sword-and-target men were known collectively as "armed men".

In fact, in the 16th century, the Spanish referred to the pike as the senora y reyna de las armas ("mistress and queen of weapons").  It was not considered at all demeaning for a man of noble birth to serve as a pikeman.  Centuries before, it would have been unheard of for a noble to fight on foot, but by the Renaissance, things had changed enough where it was suitable for a gentleman to serve in the infantry, as long as he used a "noble" weapon--a hand weapon--as opposed to one that killed at a distance.  Cavalrymen could use pistols, since they were mounted.  Everything was a cultural and caste-oriented trade-off, I guess.  

Think also about the early term the Spanish used to describe the fighting methods of the Filipinos--armas de mano.

And contrast all of the above with the Spanish term for firearms--armas de fuego.

I point out all of this so that you may better understand the term "white arm" or "white weapon".

What does "arrebatar" mean?

arrebatar: this is a full-power cut, delivered from the shoulder.  In European fencing, a cut can be delivered from the wrist, the elbow, or the shoulder.  It was noted that the cut from the wrist was quickest, but also the weakest.  Likewise, the cut from the shoulder was the most powerful, but also the slowest.  The cut from the elbow was a happy "middle ground".

What kind of cut is used depends on the tactical situation, as well as the design of sword.  Speaking very generally, European swordsmen using single-handed weapons have favored cuts from the wrist and elbow, though cuts from the shoulder were employed when applicable.

In early modern saber fencing, the cut from the elbow is known as a molinello (old term for "windmill") in Italian, and as a moulinet in French.  It resembles FMA's redonda.  The molinello is still taught in the Italian School, but it's very rarely seen in competition these days.  There was, however, an Olympic-level Russian sabreur at my old salle who used it with some frequency.

Does "atracar" mean "atacar" or something else?

I honestly don't know, but in Italian, attaccare means "to attack" or "to stick".  In what context was the term used?

What does "propino'" mean?

I have no idea.  Again, in what context was it used?

You mentioned "tipped" in regards to this word; the Italian word for "tip" is punta, and this is also a period Italian term for certain sword thrusts.  For example, a thrust that comes from the attacker's left side (hitting the defender's right) is known as a punta riversa (attacks coming from the left are riversi, while attacks coming from the right are mandritti).

So, perhaps "propino" is a reference to some sort of thrust, or to the tip of the weapon in question?

That's all I know, folks.

Peace,

David Black Mastro/TFS

69
Martial Arts Topics / My Mother Passed Away 8/4/03
« on: August 10, 2003, 06:39:56 AM »
Hello Everyone,

Things have been busy for me as of late; my mother (who suffered from Alzheimer's and congestive heart failure) recently died.

This has been a very difficult two years (the time that she was in a nursing home), and I have had a lot on my plate (and still do, now that I have to sell her old house, which I have been living in), but I simply wanted to thank Guro Crafty for having such a great website, where I could "get away" from time to time and share MA experiences with fellow enthusiasts.  I would also like to thank all the practioners of various martial arts and combat sports that post on this site; I have learned something from each and every one of you.

It will be some time before I return to doing any "epic"-sized posts, but I will be around.

Best Regards To All,

David Black Mastro

70
Martial Arts Topics / Respect the knife!
« on: July 13, 2003, 05:25:28 AM »
A good idea is to show "newbies" (and others) what a real knife can do.  All too often it is assumed that people who train in FMA or other knife-oriented arts automatically know (or care) what damage a blade is capable of.  This is not always the case, and so a cutting demo can be a real eye opener.

At my school, I showed fellow students a 3/4" solid PVC dowel that was wrapped in one of those thick foam "pool noodles".  I used a Cold Steel SRK to slice this thing up.  Aside from the fact that the knife easily cut through about 2 inches of foam, the people were rather sobered by the fact that the SRK also took big chunks out of the PVC dowel itself--and this is not flimsy material.

When students see what a bladed weapon is capable of, they become more respectful of mock sparring knives (if they're smart, at least :wink: ).

71
Martial Arts Topics / man stabbed with swordfish
« on: July 12, 2003, 06:05:04 PM »
Really bizarre.

As an oddly related sidenote, I recently "Googled" for images of the espadon (the Spanish word for "great sword"--ie., the large European two-handed swords), and a bunch of swordfish pics came up!

I don't know much about swordfish, but this one looks pretty big:



Getting stuck with that thing would be like getting stuck with a rapier or estoc.  Mr. Spacek is lucky that he didn't take a thrust to the lungs or another vital organ...

72
Martial Arts Topics / Re: restall's book
« on: June 17, 2003, 06:33:28 PM »
Quote from: Sun_Helmet
Yes David... the book is currently in print.

Crafty, I'd suggest checking out the same book. Good stuff. There's lots of info which support the African contributions. As you said, the slave trade was a bit different in SA. The Conquistadores would grant the slaves freedom if they distinguished themselves in battle against the natives... which became an incentive. Some of the Africans who helped are listed by the chroniclers by name.

However, much of the historical omission has to do with the way the Spanish viewed the slaves as a mere presence in their text but in the majority of cases, the Spanish made no effort to record an African's individual exploit or names. Whomever they were writing to probably cared even less.


Rafael,

Thanks--I'll check that book out.

BTW folks, you might find it interesting to note that the Portuguese employed African slaves in considerable numbers in their Far Eastern adventures, and they were considered among the best troops in Portuguese service there.  Author Chris Peers in the Osprey book Late Imperial Chinese Armies described them as "surprisingly loyal" (IIRC), and he also noted that, even right into the 17th century, some of them were armed as targetiers (ie., with sword and shield) and as halberdiers.

Peace,

David

73
Rafael,

Is Restall's book in print, or otherwise readily available?  It sounds extremely useful.

Also, the Mexicans have a tradition of machete fighting, which appears to have Spanish origins.  I posted on this once before, and I can post it again if anyone's interested.

Peace,

David

74
Quote from: Crafty Dog
Woof Learned Ones:

  Just a humble and very tangential yip from the airport in Mexico City:

1) I have noticed certain similarities in the complex combination of attitudes and feelings toward the United States in both Mexico and the Philippines.  In that both had analogous experiences with both Spain and the US this is not surprising.

2)  Concerning the point about the Filipinos not seeing themselves as one and the military and other ramifications thereof, it seems to be that there is also an analogy to be made with the arrival of the white man in North America.  Not only was there the dynamic between the English, the French, the Spaniards and eventually the Americans, there was the matter of the Indians not seeing themself as one-- because they were not.

When the English arrived there was the Iriquois nation/confederacy and the Algonquin nation/confederacy.  In the struggle between the English and the French much use was made of this and other indigenous divisions.

(Super-tangent:  the federalism of the US Constitution was introduced by Benjamin Franklin who got the idea from the Iriquois.)

Perhaps also analogous, in the broadest sense, to the Filipiino experience of tribes being set against tribe was the expansion of America from sea to shining sea and the use of Indian against Indian.  The Crows would be a particularly clear example of this.

End of tangent, back to lurking mode.  I really dig learning from the exchanges on this and related threads.  Thank you all!

Crafty Dog


And I, for one, would like to thank Guro Crafty and all the other DOG BROTHERS for having such a cool website.  Something that is both fun and educational is a very good thing!

Peace,

David Black Mastro

75
Rafael,

The fellow who posted as "Guest" the last two times was NOT me.

But the info you just posted was still very cool!

Talk With You Soon,

David

76
Martial Arts Topics / On Eskrima Competition Formats...
« on: June 12, 2003, 06:44:44 PM »
Quote from: guest
Dog Russ Iger runs a training group in NYC.

I've also heard good things about the Atianza group. I think the address is Atienzakali.com.


Thank you!

Anybody else with info?

77
Martial Arts Topics / I'm new to this!
« on: June 11, 2003, 10:02:29 AM »
Uh, I mean,

Welcome, wado-king!

78
Martial Arts Topics / On Eskrima Competition Formats...
« on: June 11, 2003, 10:00:42 AM »
Oops!  Forgot to login yet again... :roll:

79
Martial Arts Topics / Quality talibong replicas--where?
« on: June 08, 2003, 04:32:32 PM »
Guro Steve,

Thank you, sir!

Sincerely,

David Black Mastro

80
Martial Arts Topics / Re: Knife
« on: June 08, 2003, 07:14:50 AM »
Quote from: William
I would also recommend watching the LEO video, "Surviving Edged Weapons". Similar material covered. GT Leo Gaje and Guro Inosanto were involved in the production.


William


That is an awesome video.

81
Martial Arts Topics / Quality talibong replicas--where?
« on: June 08, 2003, 07:13:09 AM »
Does anyone know of any cutlery houses that make nice talibongs?  I love that style of sword.

82
Sheesh, I hate this login thing...

Rafael,

I wanted to add a bit to my post above, but I can't as I entered it as a "guest".

What I wanted to add was that, as far as I can ascertain, the Spanish basically saw the Filipinos on a comparable martial level to the Turks, etc.  The Spanish would never have dared to send such small numbers of men against the Turks, as they did against the New World Indians and Filipinos.  This was de Sande's point.  If the Filipinos had had arquebuses like the Turks did, then even the "arquebus strategy" wouldn't have worked--the Spanish would have had to either find totally peaceful means of colonization, or send a full-sized (ie., European sized) expedition there, which would have been monetarily impossible.

Peace,

David

83
Martial Arts Topics / Bilateralism
« on: June 06, 2003, 05:59:03 AM »
Hi Guro Crafty,

That was really interesting.

I'm hardly an expert, but it seems that bilateral training has more benefits in the health department, as opposed to the fighting department.  Training the weak side of the body is important in order to avoid an imbalance which might develop over the long term.  

English longbowmen, who used bows that had draw-weights of around 70-100 lbs, were often slightly deformed on one side of the body.

From the combative standpoint, however, I have to question how many folks will be able to achieve the ambidextrous ability of GM Luna Lema.  I personally subscribe to GM Angel Cabales' maxim of training the strong side to maximum potential.  It's probably not a good idea for longterm physical health, but I feel that it is the most practical, for most people, who are interested purely in fighting effectiveness.

Respecfully,

David Black Mastro

84
Martial Arts Topics / any ever train in fencing?
« on: June 05, 2003, 07:00:44 PM »
Dang, forgot to login again...

Anyway, I'm thinking that perhaps many of the differences that Mike and I have in regards to fencing stem from the fact that many (perhaps most) fencing schools do not adcovate the approach discussed above, and also, not all fencers (probably comparatively few) fence in that more combative manner.  

In fact, I'm wondering how much debate could have been avoided, had I realized this sooner (then again, I can be dense at times--look at how hard I find it to merely login before posting).   :shock:  :lol:

Anyway, I'll post more thoughts on all of this shortly.

Peace,

David Black Mastro

85
Rafael,

I hope all is well with you, sir.

I have been busy with various domestic matters (among other things), and have thus been absent from the DB site for some time.

Remember the big ol' FMA vs. WMA thread where you quoted from the late 16th century Spanish writer who commented on the failure of early Spanish expeditions (Magellan, Villa Lobos, etc), and said that the key to the Spanish maintaining a presence in the Philippines was the arquebus?  Could you please repost that quote, together with the author and book that it came from?  My research is (I feel) coming to a head on this topic, and that quote is a key point, in illustrating the difference between the Spanish experiences in the New World, and those in the Philippines.

I also recently managed to finally see Sir John Smythe's Certain Discourses Militarie, and some of his comments on the Spanish (specifically in regards to their conquests in the New World) are also interesting, and seem to only verify my findings on this subject.

Any help would be appreciated.

Bahala Na,

David Black Mastro

86
Martial Arts Topics / any ever train in fencing?
« on: June 05, 2003, 05:54:08 AM »
Sorry!

Yes, that was obviously me in the post above--I forgot to login!

Peace,

David Black Mastro

87
Martial Arts Topics / any ever train in fencing?
« on: June 04, 2003, 12:34:30 PM »
Modern fencing is not a martial art.

It is a combat sport, and if you keep that in mind, you can learn much from it.

With all due respect, Mike_c is just plain wrong.  Assuming that he is the same Mike_c I am thinking of (being that he's an ARMA bloke who loves to criticize fencing), I can say that I have had several debates with him on the issue of modern Western sports fencing, both here and at MMA.tv (where I moderate on the History Forum as TrueFightScholar), and I have yet to see him make a worthwhile case against it.  That being said, I would also like to stress that Mike is a smart guy, and I respect his opinions on a host of other martial topics.  We actually tend to agree on most other things, but the worth of modern fencing definitely isn't one of them.

SoonerBJJ,

If you want to know more about modern Western sports fencing, I'll be happy to steer you in the right direction.

William,

I'd like to know more about your fencing experiences, as well as your opinions concerning the sport.  I, too, train in FMA, and so I think it would be interesting to compare notes.

Peace,

David Black Mastro

aka Spadaccino

aka TrueFightScholar

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