soempat

[califkali]

With Pak Vic based in So. Cal. Has anybody trained the Serak curved stick style Soempat?

[tankerdriver]

I thnk you mean another art. Soempat is more emty hand isn't it.

[califkali]

Tankdriver, Check out Serak.com. Go to products, then videos. I have no info on the art, looking at the sticks hard to picture a real power shot.  Craig

[Guide Dog]

Craig,

Off the top of my head, I believe that Pak Vic has a DVD (single or series, I don't know) called "Blitzing Sticks", and if I am not mistaken, the DVD has a guest spot from one Guro Dan Inosanto. I believe that it was put out by Unique Productions. All of that is without me getting up to look through old issues of Inside Kung-fu to verify. I don't know if that DVD is on the Serak site or not, or if that helps.

Sorry to plug another video on the DBMA forum. Let's just say that you'll also need a copy of the first RCSF DVD "Power" to figure out if you can get a good shot from those curved sticks. 

[Crafty_Dog]

Woof Guide Dog:

My memory jibes with yours-- and no worries about mentioning his DVDs, Pak Vik is a friend of ours.

TAC,
CD

[tankerdriver]

It would be interesting to see a pure Serak player in one of the Dog Brothers Gatherings. Not to take anything away from them and the art, but I believe...uh such a person would get destroyed. Curved sticks and all.

[tankerdriver]

I bought Pak Victor's book Serak the Tsunami, it was good. In it he goes through his lineage. I visited his website recently and there he pretty much disinherits his whole lineage? From Robert Vannatta on down. Weird?

[Crafty_Dog]

He and his brother Paul had a big falling out.

[MonyetNakal]

Hello all,

Just for clarification's sake Serak and Soempat are separate arts (although I suppose it could be said that Soempat is a "daughter" art of Serak in the same manner that Tongkat or Bukti Negara are.) Soempat is the personal expression of Maha Guru Victor's teacher Pak Tisari Mardjoeki and is indeed primarily a stick discipline. Most students of Pak Vic's have some training in the Soempat system but sadly for the interest of testing it in the Dog Brother's laboratory, with the obvious exception of Pak Vic, there aren't currently any individuals that I'm aware of that are trained high enough in that particular art that I would consider a fair representation of it at a Gathering. (Although there are definitely plenty of very qualified Serak players out there.)

At the risk of sounding "cop out-y," or falsely "brag-y" I personally would not wish to see a fight with some hefty Soempat sticks involved strictly from a safety perspective. Before I get jumped on let me say that my worries don't stem from the "lethality" of the system or anything silly or hubristic like that but my concerns arise just from the physicality of the shape of the sticks. Any headshots that might slip through would essentially be the equivalent of a punyo strike but delivered at "full swing" velocity.



(Oh, I suppose that I should also clarify that work matters have prevented me from training for several months so I apologize to anyone if I am speaking out of turn and any comments I make are my own and in no way represent Pak Vic or the VDT Academy. Seems unnecessary and silly but folks do tend to misrepresent on the Intranetz. Y'all are shocked I know... )

[Crafty_Dog]

That sounds about right to me, thank you for helping flesh things out.

Back in the 80s at the Glencoe Ave Inosanto Academy, Pak Vic unerringly zeroed in on a suberb rattan stick I had-- a very special stick.  Far too hefty for a "DB friends at the end of the day" fight.  This stick had a remarkable ability to destroy all sticks that trained against it-- and Pak Vik spotted it right away.  He asked to move with it and his eyes lit up-- so I had to give it to him 

Indirect point of the story-- I agree about some systems being oriented towards sticks too destructive for our type of fighting and that Pak Vik's is one of them.

[tankerdriver]

I always wondered how the short elbow strikes of Serak would do in MMA. You know the ones that go diagonal like the elbow strikes  in Juru 1. They would be very effective from the clinch, because you can't see them coming.

[tankerdriver]

Eric Paulson was in a recent martial arts mag, in it he states he's a professional fighter and doesn't train in techniques that don't work, like Silats foot sweeps. Whoa!!! That's real Taboo!!!

[Jonobos]

Eric Paulson was in a recent martial arts mag, in it he states he's a professional fighter and doesn't train in techniques that don't work, like Silats foot sweeps. Whoa!!! That's real Taboo!!!

Well, how do people train those sweeps? Usually its on someone just standing around not resisting. If judo and bjj players stopped training on resisting opponents that stuff would not work either. I suspect the training methodology is mostly at fault here.

I also wonder about the logic in declaring that the technique doesn't work when it is only being considered in the terms of its stand alone success. Do you only throw one strike at a time or do you combo them together? You are not looking to take someones head off with the jab, and perhaps the aim of those sweeps is not so much different? They may not even be intended as the terminating motion in a throw... If they get the guy on his heels and open for another takedown/flurry then I would call them successful yes?

[Crafty_Dog]

Well, few people are as entitled to an opinion as EP!

That said, I have also read that he has a similar opinion about trapping, yet I have personally seen him in a vigorous sparring session at RAW pak sao someone who went the distance for the UFC heavyweight title.

FWIW, I do think the Silat sweeps work IF you go about crashing to clinch on angles.

[tankerdriver]

I used to work at Rock 'n' Rodeo in Bakersfield as a bouncer, everytime there was trouble, trapping and foot sweeps always worked for me. Had them off balance every time. One guy asked me what I was doing, and I told him shit I don't even know.

[JAK]

Soempat does use curved sticks but is also a wicked edged weapons art.

JAK