Blocking ROOF/UMBRELLA vs. 4 Walls

[Combative]

Hello!

I want to interduce myself, I train many years DBMA under my instructor Benjamin "Lonely Dog" Rittiner from Berne (Switzerland). I`m a trainer in DBMA under Benjamin. I saw Marc several times at his seminars in Berne.

Well, here is my question. When I have beginners, I teach the "4 walls" first, because it seems to be the easiest blocking maneuver at the highline and the cross step for the lowline.

I have a common problem with beginners, that the roof/umbrella is harder to apply in a combative situation. I know that the stickgrappling (enter with a roof) happens at the gatherings, but my main focus for now is in self defense. I want to stay outside.

So, I feel that the chance is higher to get caught with a fake when you use roof/umbrella than the 4 walls. (I`m aware of the danger of hand hits)

We know all the phrase "keep it simple", what would you teach at a self defense seminar with beginners? Would you teach all of the basic blocks, or would you skip the roof and the umbrella? I`m not sure if the "false lead game" is too early to teach it, because this beginners haven`t a foundation yet (basic strikes, footwork, blocks).

What is your opinion?

Ok, I wish you a nice day!

Peace

Combative

PS: Marc, I `m JUAN, I wasn`t able to visit your last seminar in Berne, because of a wedding. I think you know who I am.

[Crafty_Dog]

Woof Juan:

Of course I remember who you are!

Lets see if I can answer your questions.

I am a bit confused by your use of the term "4 Walls".  4 Walls, at PT term, was taught in #4 in the RCSFg series with the high line defense being tip up and the low line defense being tip down.  As discussed in "Combining Stick and Footwork" we generally prefere the cross step for defending the low line over tip down blocks-- so if you are teaching the cross-step for the low line, what communicates to me is that you are really teaching "2 Walls", i.e. the inside and outside sweeps for the high line.

These "tip up" blocks are good and important blocks in any well-rounded stickfighting structure and are part of DBMA.  A version of them is also taught in the Krabi Krabong drills we incorporate into the system.

A potential problem is that if one is done too soon that one is susceptible to a fake horizontal strike that converts to a vertical strike.  Also, many people have trouble counterstriking out of tip up blocks as quickly and strongly as the tip down (roof, umbrella) blocks.  Also if we can only block tip up, then fundamental snake motions such as the clock are not available to us.

I'll agree that the umbrella against the backhand strikes is a more evolved skill than an outside sweep, and as such proably does not apply right away with beginners, but for vertical strikes the roof, which can be used either for long range counters or crashing, seems to me fundamental and as you develop your technique for teaching it, I think your people will find it rather intuitive and difficult to be faked-- especially when combined with the cross-step.

I agree that the false lead requires certain pieces in place first, which by definition excludes beginners  

Does this help?
Guro Crafty

[Combative]

Hi Crafty!

Thank you for the quick answer, it does help!

Well, I`m aware of the danger to get hit to the hand when I`m using this "2 Walls" block (highline).

I want to explain to you why I prefer the 2 walls instead of using the roof/umbrella, because for me are these blocks very natural motions.

I feel more safe, because this kind of defense is very tight. Even if someone fakes a high forehand and uses suddendly a reverse angle, I will get it with this 2 walls. But I feel akward when I`m using a roof and the guy changes his angle, I have the impression that I get caught easier with this second strike.

I see your point when you said, it`s easier to counter after a roof/umbrella, because you don`t have to chamber your hand for your counter. You said that the clock movement is not appropriate at this time, but the happy dog is very nice (for my structure)

I talked with Benjamin, please check your PN

Peace

Juan