June 2007 Gathering

[Kaju Dog]

As this will be my first DB's gathering and I plan on fighting, I am curious about the amount of experienced fighters that will be participating.  I know that this poll does not give one a true idea of a fighters background or experience.  However, I am curious about how many "Gathering of the pack" first timers plan on fighting.

V/R,
Dean

[arkangel]

hey Dean, if all goes well, my self and three others are coming. for one of them it will be the second time. the other two are noobs.

[Kaju Dog]

hey Dean, if all goes well, my self and three others are coming. for one of them it will be the second time. the other two are noobs.

Hope to see you all there...  To me its all about meeting like minded people and learning from the experiences as a whole.  "Friends at the end of the day"
 

[arkangel]

i am not trying to sound like an "old hand" because i only made it to one previously, but i think you will have a blast and meet some truly "real" people. i am so stoked already i am vibrating. i had such a good time.

[Scotty Dog]

I'm in  a bit of a weird place. I've fought at 2 gatherings before, but they've both been in europe.

So it's not my 1st gathering, but it is a first for me.

[pappydog]

Getting the most from your Gathering Experience

I paraphrase Crafty "Just show up." More specifically "90% of life is just showing up." Just getting out there is a feat. But you have to fight opponents better than you, guys equal, and yes opponents who are not as good as you. Some of us try to find guys who are not as good as we are. You also have to fight opponents who are smaller sized, equal sized and BIGGER than you. That is why we have the privilege of having a weapon. For some of us that is hard. I consider myself right in the middle. So I can pick or be picked by guys on either side of the spectrum.

I will relay a story. For anyone who doesn't know, there was a fellow, 240, 6'2, known as Dogzilla who also went by names like the "Juggernaut." At one of the Gatherings, he went around asking for fights. He is a very polite, soft spoken person. Persons would either walk away as he came up knowing what he was going to ask or simply decline. There was another person. Greg Van Zuyen- as he was known at the time. 140 lb with change in his pockets, artist. Not much experience under his belt. As relayed to me from Dogzilla- Greg walks all the way across the mat, around and through several groups of guys and walks straight to him. "Wanna Fight?"

Dogzilla politely declined (Dogzilla wanted to really mix it up that day and thought he might hurt him, no arrogance- just fact). But said "he was the only guy who asked him for a fight that day."

This forum, The Gathering, is meant to gather experience. It is there for you - so grab it. Certainly, some days we feel braver and more fit than others. It is a career, a stickfighting career. Get em next time. Just make sure there is a next time.

I look forward to your ideas and opinions
Pappydog

[Crafty_Dog]

WOOF!!!

[Howling Dog]

Woof, Nice post Pappydog!! Very well said.
I have a story kinda like that onley different........
Different that in my case I was the bigger fighter, but when asked by Lonley dog to fight I was too afraid.
I regret that to this day, and hope to someday have the privledge of fighting (IMHO) one of the top fighters in DBMA.

I'am still afraid, but the privlidege and honor it would be, is something I hope will be a stronger motivator, than the fear is a detractor.
In other words I hope someday this happens.
                                                                                      Tom

[Guard Dog]

I have a story kinda like that onley different........
Different that in my case I was the bigger fighter,

I had a similar experience at my first gathering!

  Along the same lines: With the cattle prod fight we did in the last gathering I had trouble finding anyone who wanted to venture into the unknown with me.  When Tom contacted me I was unsure of who he was and his physical attributes.  I was afraid as well that he would be some giant that I just sent a virtual hand shake to!  He was one of the smaller fighters I have fought and let me attest that smaller and lighter doesn't always mean an easier fight.    I can remember my fight with Justin Hall being the same way    I think for future gatherings I am going to continue to look for technical fighters who can push me but are not out of my class on either end of the spectrum.  I have finally had the chance to watch a lot of fighters and think I have a good idea of who would be good matches in gatherings to come.  WOW, I'm getting excited just thinking about it!

Gruhn

[Kaju Dog]

My top student posted a quote on my forum that I feel is appropriate to insert here...  Not sure who said it first but I heard it from him.

"I can live with loosing a good fight, but I can not live without fighting it."

Looking forward to seeing you all soon    and thank you for sharing...

V/R,
Dean

PS
Im bringing my med bag, feel free to use the contents on me if/when I am in need...

[Guard Dog]

Dean,
  Would you mind listing the basics of your bag?  It would be cool to know what is on hand.

Gruhn

[Kaju Dog]

Dean,
  Would you mind listing the basics of your bag?  It would be cool to know what is on hand.

Gruhn

Hold on, here we go:

Hemorage control -
Tourniquets, Quick Clot, Various sizes of battle dressings, kurlex (gauze), cravats (triangle bandages), suture supplies, skin stappler, chest seals, occlusive dressings, 4x4's 2x2's, telfa non-stick pads.

Airway -
Emergency Cricothyroidotomy kit, Entubation tubes, Nasopharangeal airways, Oralpharangeal airways, manual sucktion device, Ambu bag, pocket mask, needle thorcentesis kit.

Circulation -
IV bags, Normal saleen, lactated ringers. Tubing and cathaters...

Vital signs -
Pulse ox, thermometer, BP cuff, Stethascope

C-spine -
C-collars

Fractures -
Sams splints, finger splints

Sprains/strains -
Ace wraps, ice packs.

Burns -
Water gel (burn wraps), seran wrap, silver sulfadiazine 1% burn cream.

Pain meds, lidocain & antibiotics, sorry guys no narcotics...  Bring your own presciptions. 

MedEvac
Litter/stretcher

Thats just one of my bags...  

Oh yeah, band aids, steri strips and skin glue.

If you have any requests let me know... 

I would be happy to teach a quick Emergency Tactical Trauma Patient Assesment set...  I've been the Tactical Combat Casualty Care senior instructor for the last 2 years and have taught/certified over 1,000 MARINES.  Not to mention perfomed Combat Casualty care while serving in Iraq.  They even gave me some fancy chest candy for it...

I enjoy helping others and love to teach, but not as much as I love to learn.  "Watch it, Learn it, Live it, Teach it"

Maybe a quick class before I get broken would be good....  Or if there is someone else qualified (I know I wont be the only medically trained there), introduce me to em and they can use my supplies as needed...  Goodtimes!

Oh, and I will be bringing Med training aids for Crafty.

[Guard Dog]

Razors to shave hair away from cuts would be a nice addition.   

Gruhn

[Kaju Dog]

Razors to shave hair away from cuts would be a nice addition.   

Gruhn

Got em - just forgot to list em...  Trauma shears, tweezers, scalpul, all the usual tools, eye patches, eye drops, anti-fungal creme, bacitracen, H.E.E.N.T. kit, dental lidocain, rubber malet & medical tape too.

See, now you got me thinking.  Im not trying to come across sarcastic, Im just pretty obsessive compulsive or "anal" (as my brotheren say) when it comes to being prepared.  Yep, all in one bag...  I might bring a couple other bags just in case.   

It's realy not recomended to shave the area anymore...  Just trim the hair down close to the skin.  Shaving increases risk of infections (ie ingrown hairs during the healing stages) 

Good eye...  Thanks for catching that.

[Crafty_Dog]

Dean:

Please consider contributing as much as you like on this thread:

http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=1178.0

Thank you,
CD

[Kaju Dog]

Dean:

Please consider contributing as much as you like on this thread:

http://dogbrothers.com/phpBB2/index.php?topic=1178.0

Thank you,
CD

My bad Crafty...  Got off on a tangent here.  I am working on some good useful knowledge for the appropriate thread. 

V/R,
Dean

[Crafty_Dog]

Not a tangent, quite the contrary-- it is quite relevant to the Gathering.  I'm just hoping you will continue to contribute in this vein and was letting you know where to do it were you so inclined.

[Dog Greg Brown]

The gathering is a learning experiance, and like Nick says,

"But you have to fight opponents better than you, guys equal, and yes opponents who are not as good as you."

It is a perfect example of how much and how hard you really want to test yourself. I look at the gathering is more of a test of yourself than of your skills. To see if you can be present with the high levels of agression and adrenaline. To keep your brain thinking rather than just reacting is a feat. Its a feat not matched anyway else in competetive combat sports. My opinion of course.

I have a funny gathering story about looking for fights and taking fights that you are in no way ready for. To illustrate the point that at a gathering even though you may be out classed by the guy on the other side of the mat your safe (safe being a realitive term while talking about gatherings )

As my second gathering was drawing to a close and I was pretty beat Top came up to me and asked if I'd like to fight. Now as far as I knew he didn't ask people to fight, so of course being the naive 20year old that I was I said yes. Little did I know that I was played, right after I agreed he sent me out on the mat to fight Chris "true dog" Clifton. I was in no way ready to fight someone like Chris. But I did and he knew how nervous I was and even though he def had the better of the fight and I took some shots he never brought it to the level of seriously hurting me.

That fight is what really hooked me on the gatherings. Since then we have fought 2 more times, both ending slightly quicker and more painfully, but I keep coming back. You may get hurt, but its never going to break your spirit. Thats whats so special about it.

Anyway I can't wait for june.

Greg

[Howling Dog]

Woof Dog Greg, Much props for taking that fight, the first time and your courage to fight true dog 2 times to follow.
True dog is one tough cookie and someone to be feared.
Hats off!
Speaking of true dog.......was he at the Nov. gathering......seems hes missing? Anyone know whats become of him?
                                                                         Tom

[Guide Dog]

1. "Let's go out there and hurt each other a little bit."  I always say something like this to my training partner before we go out and fight.  I always try to get them to laugh with me before we step out there and hit each other with sticks.  I was just realizing right now that I don't know what word to use to refer to the other men who fight with me during the Gatherings.  What's the right word?  Partner/brother/warrior? All seem appropriate.  "Opponent" doesn't seem right.  I don't mean to disrespect the warriors I have fought or will fight in June.  They give me MAJOR game and I have been "killed" many times.  I know that using the word "opponent" might be helpful to put me in a more aggressive mental state.  The problem is that if I really try to think of my partner as someone who is threatening my family and I use that, there might be a little hate in my heart.  I don't think that this would turn all 5'7" of me into a "mindless killing machine" (I'm more Jack Russell Terrier than a Doberman anyways), but Gatherings have nothing to do with hate.  At the same time, I want to respect my opponent and give him a chance to test himself.  It's a fine line to walk.  I have wondered many times after a fight if I am aggressive enough for DBMA.

2. What I really love about the Gatherings is that they are a good model for how the world should be: two men with aggression realize that aggression exists and they go and use that aggression to test themselves and to grow.  After the fight ends, while it might seem like a terrible cliche, both men have won because they know themselves better.  Wouldn't it be great if all of the stupid people in the stupid places doing stupid things (Guru Crafty's expression) could fight in the same way?  One young man with no healthy outlet for his aggression says something dumb to another young man.  The second young man hits him in the face and the first young man realizes what he said was wrong.  They argue over who should buy the beer and they both feel like they know themselves better.  No one calls their friends or pulls out a knife.  Maybe it's wrong to dream about a utopia but maybe that's a vision that's tied into the heart of DBMA. 

P.S. Most of my posts always come back to how we can use the martial arts to improve the state of the world.  I teach junior high in a fairly tough neighborhood.  If only some of my students would hit each other with sticks once in a while.  They would be a lot happier!  I look forward to hurting and getting hurt a little bit by some of you in June.

[Guard Dog]

I've always used the term "Blood Brother" for people who I have fought    This actually came from my first fight where I fought one of Sled Dog's boys in a no rules tournament and Tuhon Gaje & Guro I. were the judges.  After the fight I turned to Tuhon Gaje and Guro I. to show my respect and Gaje smiled and told me (I wish I could have remembered this verbatim) to go over and give my new blood brother a hug    It stuck with me from there on.

Woof!

Gruhn

[Howling Dog]

Woof, I like this thread so far......Guys talking about their gathering experiences gives some insight and helps with how others may feel about this event. Anyway.......
When I was prepairing for my first gathering, I was doing a lot of chattering moslty on the members sight.....fear being the bigger factor.
I was asking Guro Crafty if it would be ok to just do a knife fight, he and others strongly discouraged me from this, which I was ultimatly glad he did I fought two stick fights that day.
The thing is to not onley go there and fight but to test ones self under a multitude of conditions, one of which is to fight and be able to function when dinged up.....after a fight or more than one fight......So for me. my personal challenge is to also fight as many fights as I can in one day(not counting knife) also against good opponents or opponents that will push me.
Soooo.....My question is how many STICK  fights have you been able to pull of in a single gathering.
My best is a frustrating two at two gatherings.
I hope to do better this June .......
                                                                                     TG
P.S. In my first fight last June I fought a pretty good opponent and he dinged me considerably, but I seemed to learn a lot from that fight, and one thing I found was even though I was getting hit a lot I was still functional and fighting.
For me huge growth in that.

[Howling Dog]

Woof, Since no one has yet responded to my previous post, I'am guessing that by asking for the number of stick fights fought at a single gahtering was the wrong approach to what I was actually looking for.

It was NOT intended to be a one upsmanship thing where one person would brag about fighting 3 fights and another 4 and so on and on.
Having onley fought in two gatherings and having fought onely two stick fights per gathering I certainly have nothing to brag about.
My thought was to have fighters express their growth as fighters, and things they have learned not onley from fighting, but also from experiencing adverse conditions such as going back out to fight after maybe not doing so well the previous fight or when really tired or slightly injured ect. ect.
That kinda thing.
I have always felt and exeperienced most growth when I have been out of my comfort zone and been forced to experience things I may not in a normal situation have chosen or liked to have experienced but survived it anyway.........
Hope to hear some from gahtering experiences.
                                                                                 TG

[pappydog]

It isn't a bad question. 1 to 8 fights. I usually fight 1 to 4 fights. Have never done more than that. Stick fights is what I am referring to. Top dog I have seen do 8. I am most pleased with myself when I do 4. However, 2 good fights are 2 good fights. The first fight is good to get out there and if I stop there I feel I have short changed myself. Top and Salty used to say after 2 you are warmed and ready for your good fights. It is all personal. For me, the fights are what train for. The experience that I gain from them is what I bring back to the classroom and use to augment my training.

Nick

[Crafty_Dog]

In Dog Brothers lore, we speak of the founding of the Dog Brothers in Ramblas Park in San Clemente in 1988 (The Rumble in Ramblas).  With one or two exceptions, everyone there fought about 7 fights a day for three consecutive days.  On day one, it was hard sparring.  By day three it was hard fighting.  One fighter who showed up on the third day was definitely at a disadvantage.  Salty has spoken of the importance of having a period where one does a lot of fighting and getting to the point where it seems normal. 

Amongst the many things I have always admired about Top Dog was the number of fights he could take in a day.  Back in 2001 in his seventh fight of the day he fought a very formidable man who had had only one easy fight.

Salty Dog too was capable of a very high number of fights in one day.  He and Top Dog would go at it in Santa Fe NM or Long Beach CA for consecutive days.  Very impressive.

For me, 4-5 was a good number, but this often dropped to 3 when Top and Salty were on sabbatical for several years and not only did I have to guide the Gathering (e.g. this group was feeling testy with that group, someone was sneaking videos, etc) but I was Ringmaster, coaching my students and fighting as the "name" fighter for the DBs.

[Sheep Dog]

For myself 3 stick fights is a nice good number, but sometimes you just don't know. I remember fighting one gathering where in my first fight I fought a friend of mine, and even though I had more experience than he did we just had a war that seemed to go on forever, I spent the remainder of the afternoon sucking wind and trying to stop my head from bleeding.

Marc

[Howling Dog]

Woof Pappydog, Seems as I remember you having somthing to do with this....... Tastes like chicken if I remember correctly .
          http://dogbrothers.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2061
                                                                                       TG

[Crafty_Dog]

War Dog just called me to say he is fighting! 

[Scotty Dog]

Guro, Did you get my e-mail about the gathering?

[Crafty_Dog]

Yes, and all is well with what you said.  Email me again please.

[Scotty Dog]

You've got mail again 

[Crafty_Dog]

A Howl of Greeting:

The rhythm of the seasons is with us and its time for the "Summer Dog Brothers Gathering of the Pack". On behalf of the Council of Elders of the Dog  Brothers, Dog Brothers Inc. Martial Arts hereby cordially invites all people of good spirit to its "Dog Brothers Summer Gathering of the Pack" at 11:00 AM on Sunday, June 24, 2007 at the R-1 Gym in El Segundo to conclude when the fighters are done.

Many of you may remember our Gatherings held in the park in Hermosa Beach, which, although they were hosted at considerable expense, were always free to you our friends, our guests. However with a private facility involved we now need to charge admission of $15. We ask that you still consider yourselves to be our friends and our guests. In this context we ask that you respect our wishes in the matter of Video.

It is very simple:

NO VIDEO CAMERAS, NO DUAL PURPOSE CAMERAS (i.e. with both still photo and video capabilities). THIS MATTER IS OF IMPORTANCE TO US! And, if you see someone videoing, please don't let them abuse our hospitality-please let us know.

As always, you may take photographs for personal, non-commercial use PROVIDED you give us a complete set of the ones you take. Thanks to the increasing numbers of you who actually remember and bother to do this! It is very much appreciated!


The Magic Words:

The MAGIC WORDS: "No judges, no referees, no trophies. One rule only: Be friends at the end of the day. This means our goal is that no one spends the night in the hospital. Our goal is that everyone leaves with the IQ with which they came. No suing no one for no reason for nothing no how no way! Real Contact Stickfighting is Dangerous and only you are responsible for you. Protect yourself at all times. All copyright belongs to Dog Brothers Inc. CA law applies."

This matter of accepting the risk applies to those of you in the crowd too. For example, sticks, and fights for that matter, may go flying into the crowd. Parents should consider things like this in deciding whether a child is old enough to bring along and/or deciding on from where to observe the event. For example, sitting on the heavy bags ringing the fighting area is a really risky idea for a child (or adult for that matter). If a stick or a fight comes careening your way-get out of the way!

This matter of copyright is of particular importance with this Gathering. It is looks likely that Original Productions (who did the "Pilot" clip you see on our front page) will be recording the day as part of a one hour documentary that will appear on National Geographic!  OP will be at the door with some sort of legal release giving it permission to have you (fighters & audience members) appear in the documentary, not sue them, etc. OP also will be looking to interview some of the fighters for the documentary.

Assuming the deal with OP/Nat Geo comes together, the Gathering may be held in a warehouse owned by OP in the Burbank area.  I have seen it and it seems like a very promising location.  Director Dan Jackson will be working with me to assure that the fighting area is everything that it should be and seating and viewing conditions should be very good.

At this Gathering, we will continue starting the knife fights with a handshake and the knives undrawn. Again we encourage you to fight knife versus stick-- the stick versus electric knife fight last time was a great success and the electric knife will again be available. Stick vs. knife has been one of perennial questions of the FMA, so let's continue the research!

Remember that you may fight with weapons other than a stick if you can find someone willing to go against you. Please consider staff, double stick, and anything else. In order to more deeply explore certain variables, fighters may agree to "no grappling" rules. In staff fights, the fighters may wear wrestling type ear guards under the fencing masks.

There is no charge for fighters but FIGHTERS MUST PRE-REGISTER, even if they have fought before. WE WILL BE RUTHLESS ON THIS!  The Fighter's Registration form can be found on the website and must be filled out whether you have fought before or not. For all Fighter Registration matters, please contact Cindy at info@dogbrothers.com 310-540-6853. You are not registered until your name appears on the list of registered fighters on the website!!! 

As I write this (March 26th) we already have 22 fighters listed (from throught the US, Canada, Switzerland, Germany, Great Britain, Australia) which is the most we have ever had this far in advance.   With the probability of the Nat Geo documentary, as Gathering time approaches Cindy will be very busy.  We strongly suggest that you register as far in advance as possible.

"Higher Consciousness through Harder Contact"

Crafty Dog
Guiding Force of the Dog Brothers
Dog Brothers Inc. Martial Arts

310-543-7521 (Remember, please use 310-540-6853 for matters concering registration)

Craftydog@Dogbrothers.com

[Howling Dog]

Guro Crafty, The summer gathering will indeed be held at the R-1 gym?
                                                                       TG

[Crafty_Dog]

"Assuming the deal with OP/Nat Geo comes together, the Gathering may be held in a warehouse owned by OP in the Burbank area."

[Crafty_Dog]

We now have over 30 fighters registered. We have never had so many registered so far in advance. In addition to the US, we have fighters from Switzerland, Germany, Scotland, UK, Canada, Australia and Tahiti.

[Mongo Gary]

40 in aug!!! And reading this makes my blood lust pump through me !!! I wish I could be there and sound like a delight full time he he he. Hey Tom Guthrie if you read this I'm about 35 min away from you!!! In Wadsworth Ohio and been doing kali since 1988 and looking for partners! Maybe we could  team up and train and I been doing some sparing with my training partner and never been to a gathering but reading this wants me to quit my job and head for Cali to experience this myself. I cant wait to hear about the results about this gathering. Mongo

[Howling Dog]

Woof Mongo Gary, You don't have to quit your job to experience the gathering. Its held on Sunday afternoon. Take a long weekend.....
Anyway if you want to try to get together send me a email = spinebuster77@yahoo.com we can see if our schedules match up at all.
                                                                         Dog Tom/SB

[Kaju Dog]

Yeah  ,  the poll now shows that I am no longer the only first time Gathering fighter!  Im not alone...   
I can stop howling at the moon now. 

[Tom Stillman]

At my second gathering I remember trying early in the day to find someone to fight against my nunchuk's. I wasn't having much luck.  As the day went on I had a stickfight or two. Still no takers with the chuk,s. Next thing I hear is Marc getting ready to call it a day.  I was so desperate for a fight I interupted Marc (no disrespect was intended) and loudly challenged anyone who was willing , to a fight as I swung my nunchaku over my head and  walked down the row of fighters to make it clear what I was talking about.. There was a brief pause 5 seconds maybe  and then I heard a familiar voice call out" Ill fight you " It was TOP DOG.     I thought to myself, "Now I did it.. Me and my big mouth". I think Pappydog said it best when he said "It's like jumping out of an airplane when parachuting. Once you jump,there is no turning back". And yes, Top Dog was merciful.       Much respect to all the fighters.

[C-Kumu Dog]

Yeah,  the poll now shows that I am no longer the only first time Gathering fighter!  Im not alone...   
I can stop howling at the moon now. 

Thats right, you are not alone and neither am I. 

Just a question, what is everyones preference? Single, Double ... Staff??

[Guard Dog]

Cattle Prod! 

Gruhn

[Kaju Dog]

Yeah,  the poll now shows that I am no longer the only first time Gathering fighter!  Im not alone...   
I can stop howling at the moon now. 

Thats right, you are not alone and neither am I. 

Just a question, what is everyones preference? Single, Double ... Staff??

I am leaning toward  "stick vs knife", "stick and knife vs whatever", stick vs stick with optional knife to be employed as  a secondary option at any point during the fight.   But Naturaly, I am looking forward the sticks vs sticks (single/double whatever).   Looking forward to the experience and getting some humble pie...   

"I can live with loosing a good fight, but I can't live without fighting it!" 

[peregrine]

Cattle Prod! 

Gruhn

Ryan, how longs your cattle prod?

[Crafty_Dog]

Woof All:

We are up to 40 registered fighters!

[Tom Stillman]

I thought I should post this here as it may involve this gathering.    Does this make it official ?  http://www.origprod.com/theshows.htm

[Crafty_Dog]

Woof All:

It looks like we will be signing the deal with OP/Nat Geo tomorrow or Friday.  Assuming this to be the case, the "DB Gathering of the Pack" will be held in OP's warehouse in Glendale.

I was there earlier today with director Dan Jackson.  The plan is for the fight area to be 30x40 of wrestling mat.   Any suggestions for how to define the perimeter?

The seating should be much better than the de minimis seating at R1.  There were church pews there, there is talk of some bleachers, and some talk of scaffolding with planks-- a touch of "Thunderdome"    We're guesstimating that we should be able to hold 300+.

To be worked out is the fighters dinner afterwords.  Options are:  Somewhere up there in the Glendale area, down in the South Bay area (Hermosa Beach, Redondo Beach) or perhaps Torrance (the all you can eat sushi place where we traditionally have gone.  Fighters, your thoughts please?

The Adventure continues!
Crafty Dog

[C-Kumu Dog]

Wow this is going to be exciting!

Guro Crafty do you think that with the addition of camera lights it will have any effect on the mask like a small kind of glare? Will the crowd be sitting around the marked off area, with the fighters in the center and do we have to worry about getting backed into the crowd? Will there be a wall? Im just curious as this will be my first time 

On a non related note is San Tee or El Cajone very far?

[Crafty_Dog]

Woof Robert:

When OP shot the Nov 2005 Gathering we did not have any problems with glare on the masks reported.

Your question about a wall/getting backed into the crowd is a good one.  It is what I was trying to get at when I said
" Any suggestions for how to define the perimeter?"

I liked the the way R1 had walls on two sides.  Its good to have walls into which to crash!  Maybe we should set the mats at OP's warehouse against one wall?

Location:

http://www.mapquest.com/maps/map.adp?searchtype=address&country=US&addtohistory=&searchtab=home&formtype=address&popflag=0&latitude=&longitude=&name=&phone=&level=&cat=&address=2435+N.+Naomi+St.&city=Burbank&state=CA&zipcode=91504

I have no idea where your "cajones" may be   You might want to check the spelling on those two locations 

TAC,
Crafty Dog

[C-Kumu Dog]

OMG, I hope to bring them with me! LOL. I checked the spelling and I believe it is El Cajon.

Yes, I think a wall would be most enjoyable!!!   How about all you other fighters?

[Tom Stillman]

Woof all,  Walls are good as long as your not the one running into them. lol.  It also keeps a higher number of spectators out of harms way. Also: Robertlk808,   I think El Cahone is about 2 hours south of Glendale. Depending on the amount of traffic it could take much longer. (maybe 1 hr or more)                                  See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/El_Cajon,_California